Motor Break in?

[maxxxracer]

I am getting a p2k and i need to know if I need to break in the motor and if so how do i do it.

[Oyster]

If you're buying new, you shouldn't have to break it in. But, since you opened the conversation, I'll give you my advice. You're going to get people telling you how it's done, some are pretty crazy. "Put your motor in a bowl of lucky charms with 2% milk, and open it up wide!"

How I do it is... run it for about 5 mins at 3 volts. Check brushes. Nice shine on all the face? Broken in. If it's not nice and shiny, not broken in. (This is how I do Mods) - I've also found that 2% milk gives less power. Use 1%. :)

- jon

[jeepinator]

My method is even simpler: don't

Motor break in is an old wive's tale, probably left over from the days of closed endbell motors from Mabuchi and Johnson.

Don't believe the hype. Just run the dang thing.

[HowieStern]

hey jeep...do you own a dyno??

wanna compare numbers of a motor with un-broken in brushes and bushings to a motor that has been broken in?? :)

there is a reason for break-in (more power and higher eff)... i break in new brushes and bushings every time...

btw... this is "how-to" thread.. not a "should i" thead... just fyi jeep...

peace out... :)

[outsider]

How is breaking in a motor and just running it normally any different? Does the extra drag of it being installed and run at half speed not let it break in properly? Do the brushes break in differently? I don't get the whole "breaking-in" thing. How exactly does it help? Or do people just say to break it in because it's the thing to do, with out any other explanation. I'd like to see a blind comparison of 2 identical motors. One is "broken in" and the other is right out of the packaging. Have them each run a couple laps and then give the radio to a driver. And then we can compare, speed, acceleration and see if a difference can be appreciated.

[maxxxracer]

this is a how to thread. please only post if u know how to break in motors.

[jeepinator]

Breaking in the motor will allow it to perform it's best the very first time you use it. If you are not concerned with the first few runs, break in is not necessary.
Either way, once the brushes are fully seated they will perform the same.

Maxxxracer, you said, "I am getting a p2k and i need to know if I need to break in the motor and if so how do i do it. "
I am telling you you don't need to break in your motor (the IF part). Why would I tell you HOW if I think you don't need to ?

[HowieStern]

you don't have to break-in an electric motor... it will run without break-in...

but if you want the most out of it... you will only get it by breaking it in... it seems jeep doesn't care about the power output of his motors... that's all fine and dandy for him i guess.... LOL....

jeep just has a habit of saying things they may not be the best set-up for most people (or anyone really)... ie- run a 3.6 amp supply on your charger... and- don't break-in your motor...

some of us care about getting peak power and life from our motors... and some of us care about getting a fully charged battery pack... LOL...

i have been looking for the link on this site for motor break in... they did a really good write up with pics on how they completely broke-in a new traxxas motor.... if anyone else has it please post...

btw.... the reason you break-in a motor at a low input voltage is to help keep heat down... your motor would get really hot in a hurry if you ran it off a 7.2 pack wide open for several minutes, and that would not be good for it...

peace out... :)

[jeepinator]

Howie, try to address the person asking the question and not the people answering it.
We all have our opinions. I'll try to do the same.
Thanks

[mikedude]

I use the comm drops to assist with breakin. From my research a motor runs better once the grooves are worn down to a smooth surface. I assume your comm is new or freshly turned? The comm drops help you get there faster. I to have heard all sorts of advice like running them in water. Can anyone say rust? Any-hoo another way to get the brushes smooth is just run it. Watch for the comm needing to be turned and your golden.

[XXXER]

Howie, your help is appreciated, and if you could just leave your reply, instead of instantly starting another one of your little slapping fights you two seem to have problems with, it would be appreciated.

Here is the article you were refering too, this was done in the April 2001 RCCA, and the link can be found HERE (http://www.rccaraction.com/articles/supercharge_stocker.asp)

Come on guys, act reasonably, do not attack eachother etc.
Thanks
-Steve

[maxxxracer]

jeep i wasnt talking about u when i said lets anwser questions not ask them. I was talking aobut the guy bashing u. he was going to lead the topic off topic.

According to RCCA the water just seats the brushed faster. no thanks, i am not that daring to get something done quicker. I will just hack up one of my stick packs taht i dont use, to power it.

[FilthyPierre]

"We take a break from the little slapping fight to bring you this message from our sponsor"

If I recall correctly, my P2K came with a little pamphlett that told you how to break it in - mainly the bushings, not the brushes (it's in the dim dark past). I recently bought another Trinity motor, a Retro series 12x2 (Pure Gold) and the little pamphlet said not to bother breaking it in.
I thought serrated brushes (P2k will have serrated brushes) eliminated the need for break-in....

"And now it's back to the slapfight..."

LOL

http://www.plauder-smilies.com/argue.gif

[maxxxracer]

thanks for the help. I have not gotten the motor yet so i dont know what the phamplet says.

[Gutter Ball]

I've been using the underwater method since I found out about it. Not ONE of my motors has a single spec of rust anywhere. If you thoroughly blast the motor with cleaner, all the water should be displaced. Then you relube the bushings/bearings and it's all good. A few of my other friends weren't keen on trying it until I did it first. No prob! So I did the dip. After we assembled our brand spanking new XXXT Spec trucks, we raced, my underwater motor vs his "just slap on and go". We dragged first one to the corner (about 45 feet) and I beat him by at least 6 feet. We did it a few more times just to make sure it wasn't a fluke. We even swapped motors and then his truck beat mine. Of course, even though the motors were the same brand, not all motors are built the same and there probably are lots of other small factors to consider. Now all my friends do the underwater trick. Eventually my friend's motor broke in and we were running nose to nose, but that took a couple of qualifiers and mains(I think 2 weeks). So it's either have the power now or later. If you're going to race competitively, I would break in the motor. If you're bashing, just load and go :)

[jeepinator]

I have used the water method in a past life. It scares me a little 'cause one time it went very wrong. I had the motor merilly spinning away and then I dipped it down in the glass of water and POOF ! The water turned silvery black almost instantly. I freaked out (well, a mini freak out ;) ) and pulled the motor back out and removed the power. I inspected the brushes and they were like 5mm long ! I had to laugh, but it was really not that funny. The motor had been out of the package like 45 seconds !

I think it was because my voltage was too high. I suppose with, say, a 3 cell or maybe a 4 cells pack it would be OK. I dunno though, the water dipping method gives me Nam flashbacks. Heheh just joking !

As far as the slapping thing goes ... how could I have possibly been more polite ? I did no slapping. None whatsoever. That was a one sided foul my friends.

maxxxracer, sorry for the misunderstanding ! I will try harder to be positive and helpful ...

[ 08-06-2001: Message edited by: jeepinator ]

[kartrun]

Jeep,you know there is some people who,no matter what you say,will always disagree!!"The sky is blue" and they reply "No,its carolina blue!"Its a no win situation!No need in trying to plead your case cause you'll never win!I have beat my head against the wall(not really)sometimes trying to prove to some guy that i was right but i always end up the same way!I say something and he comes back with some smart comment and because of his narrow mind,does not listen to reason!Anyways,my point is this,let it be man,let it be!You will look like the better man in the end if you just keep your mouth shut and make whoever it is make a fool of out of themselves!Now i know what you guys are thinking,"kart is talking about such and such!"That is not the case!I am not blasting anyone or pointing any fingers!All i am saying is sometimes its just better to say nothing at all!Jeep,have a great day(or night in my case!) ;)

[maxxxracer]

ok now that i know what the water is for i will just run the motor for 5 minutes with a 4 cell pack. That should break it in, right? I would use the water method but it kinda scares me and I also dont have all that maintinence stuff. lube, motor cleaner and comm drops. If possible can u guys suggest some of that stuff to get including tower part numbers if possible.

[Gabe]

the water break-in is better than no break-in at all...
I can't compare the diffrence I dont use any dynos; I dipped a mod last sunday...
It has always worked very well for me.
If it is a motor you don't race with then what ever works for you goes...break-in or not.
a fully broken brush causes less heat on the com. more surface area alows better current transfer; less concentrated hot spot...
if you "dip" a motor fill a big cup you don't plan on drinking out of (or wash it very well) 3/4 full of tap water...
get a battery pack,aligator clips,motor spray,and a place you can get dirty (not the carpeting in the house!!!).
hook up the motor to the battery pack,put it in the water,leave it in till the water starts to get dark...
pull it out take a spring off & check to see if the brush has a full curve that matches the com. if not put it back in the water for another 5-10 sec.
by now the water will look black...
Hard brushes will take longer than soft ones to get seated completely.
then dry it out with a generous bath of motor spray (it drys & displaces the water)
once the motor spray is dry add oil to the bushings/bearings
Good to go...
you need a motor spray to get rid of the water or the motor WILL go to JUNK...
Any kind peferibly the cheap stuff works for this purpus...

[ 08-06-2001: Message edited by: G-RC ]

[maxxxracer]

thanks for the info. I got all the stuff at tower hobbies.

[jeepinator]

kartrun, thanks for the advice. Words to live by ! I'll call it, "the kartrun factor" from henceforth ;)

maxxxxxxxx, good luck with however you do it. I think I just got very unlucky when I dipped. Too much voltage, really soft brushes. Could be anything.

I think the main goal, no matter the method, is to makes the arc on the end of the brush go from one side to the other (fully seated). If you make it this way by running it a few times (practice, messing around, whatever) before you need top power, it should be OK. Or, you can do a manual break in, as suggested by others.
For me, not being a top class racer, any differences would not be noticed. I think that holds true for the majority of the posters on this BBS.

If you are dead set on break-in I have one more method !
I have used this succesfuly in the past for mod motors. I bougt a nifty airplane propeller adaptor and a propeller (for my fan car of course ! ;) ) . When I break in a motor I just take my 4 cell lathe pack and connect it to the motor when the prop is on there. It adds an even, fairly heavy load to the motor and the air keeps it cool !
Plus it makes a crap load of cool noise to freak out the wife ! :p

[maxxxracer]

Oyster, about the milk thing lol and I saw in RCCA article that they quiclky dipped it in water, but of course now i cant seem to find that darn article.

[maxxxracer]

lol jeep. I think I will stick with the water method. why does it make alot of noise?

[HauntedMyst]

I oil the bushing, toss on a comm drop and stick the thing in the dremel tool and turn it on low for about 30 seconds.

I tried the water break in thing, but every time i filled up the tub and hopped in it with the dremel running, my heart would stop and I would black out and I would wake up with a sore chest and some sweat fireman leaning over me with his lips on mine.... blah....

[jeepinator]

I dunno. Buy one and you will see what I mean though !
Sounds like a .... ummm... like a .... uhhh ... well it is just LOUD.

[Gutter Ball]

Myst: Heh, I hope you were using a CORDLESS dremel!!! ;)

[CaseyMan]

comm drops and dremel = best way :) thats how i did it. water, electronics, and me doesnt mix very well :( Its like having a farm and putting the tigers by the chickens.. not good :) but anyway, myst idea is how id' do it. water works too tho i guess. but eventually the engine will break itself in like others say.

on side note, howiesturn, your so immature.

[maxxxracer]

Now I have heard that the only way that u wont shock yourself or dammage something with the water method is if the motor is a closed endbell motor. I dont know if this is true, but now i have changed my mind again :mad:.

I would strap a dremel up to the enginge but I dont have a dremel and cant get my dad to get one. But I have a replacement for it, I will use on of the motors from my emaxx. I can just take off one of the motors and just power one. It will last forever (run time) and it is quite strong. I would say strong enough to power it.

[william2001]

Yeah, the Dremel is probably the best way to go here. Allows you to get the brushes seated properly without ever applying power to the motor, no arcing this way. Works good for breaking in bushings too for the same reason. I race the motor when the serrations on the brush are about halfway worn, don't have dyno #'s to back that up, but the motor feels about "right" on the track, and is fast for the Main.

[SirSpeedy]

Deiter, Reedy, and Fantom Troy all run for 5min at around 3volts. You must fully seat the brushes to make good power. The serrations should be nearly gone after break in.

I have no use for running a motor that is not making good power.

[jeepinator]

... and I have better use for my time than to watch a motor spin for 5 minutes every time I change the brushes (recommended as often as every 3-5 runs by some who have posted here).

Just posting the corollary ;)

[ 08-08-2001: Message edited by: jeepinator ]

[Gutter Ball]

Ya don't have to watch it you know :) You CAN go and do something else for 5 minutes.

[jeepinator]

Oh ya ... DANG ! :p

Come to think of it, I have no use for ANY motor. I use attitude power !

[maxxxracer]

now now jeep, no need to get nasty at the smart ass.

Well ive made my decision. thanks for all your help guys.

[jeepinator]

Nah, I am just joking around. Me get nasty ? I couldn't hurt a fly :p

[Gutter Ball]

Hey, who's a smart A55?? :mad: Heh! :cool:

[maxxxracer]

no not u. It was sir speedy.

[SirSpeedy]

Oh really?

I hope you have a terrific time with your Trax Max "pede" whatever you call it, thing.

Good luck smart guy.

[jeepinator]

maxxx, I don't think he was being a smarty pants at all. Some people are just race and performance oriented.
I have no problem with doing some playing around or practicing, or whatever you want to call it on a motor that is in the process of being broken in ... but some people would rather it be race ready from the start. That is all he was saying. We disagree, and that is why I gave him a little jab. It was for fun.
Sheesh, no sense in getting all emotional ! You sound like teenage girls ! Hehehe, OK that was low :p
Lighten up, it's good for your digestion.

[maxxxracer]

I hope you have a terrific time with your Trax Max "pede" whatever you call it, thing.

what are u talking about. I dont have a pede and am not getting one.

[SirSpeedy]

I have no idea what a "pede"(as you all call them) even is??? Not a clue. I am sure it is some type of bash vehicle I would assume.

Jeeper is correct. You asked how to break in a motor. I posted the method that many of the top motor builders utilize.

Do you need to break in a motor? That depends.

Usually if I am cutting a motor, then I am at a race where I am concerned with laptimes, ideal gearing, etc. I need the motor to perform properly on lap one. I rarely cut a motor and install new brushes for a club race.

[maxxxracer]

whatever, it doesnt matter.

[1Badpede]

Sounds like speedy thinks he's too good for a "Traxxas Stampede", as if he didn't know what a 'pede was!! Must not be too knowledgeable in r/c if he's never heard of a Stampede. Pedes may not be the most expensive racers, but with a Speed Gems motor mine is a lot of fun!!!

:mad:

[jeepinator]

1Badpede, before passing judgement on SirSpeedy please do some reseach. He is easily one of the most helpful posters. He has a lot of knowledge that you can benefit from.
Flaming him like this will not do you, him, or anyone else any good !
I would bet you have misinterpreted what he wrote. Calm down and read the entire thread with an open mind.
Thanks, and welcome to the forum.

[maxxxracer]

ok we need one of the mods to delete some of these posts. From what I see, this will go on forever.

[XXXER]

hehehehehe, I love when people say things like "I am done with this thread, so, mods, feel free to delete it". Unless we find a good reason to, we will, but, so far, I have not seen anything wrong. Don't worry, I read pretty much every thread, everyday, no worries, the trash does get picked up around this joint(Well, SteveP is the head janitor, I am still in training, hehe)

1badpede, or whatever your name is(sorry, forgot), SirSpeedy is a talented racer, and really does not care to bash RC's, he focuses on racing, that is why he does not know what they are, and so what.

-Steve

[maxxxracer]

lol @ xxxer. I didnt mean the whole forum, just a few posts but if u dont think it is neccesary then no prob.

[1Badpede]

xxxer, thanks for not deleting me!!!
I just felt like he was bashing Traxxas, and I think they make a great product for playing around in the backyard. Speedy, if you weren't bashing Traxxas I apologize.

[roadrage]

:D

[ 08-11-2001: Message edited by: roadrage ]

[nitrodriver]

why dont you get a P2k PRO? its already broken in...

[maxxxracer]

I am getting the pro version.

[Railman]

It's not too unusual for racers not to know what basher's nicknames are for their vehicles. It took me forever to figure out what a "Pede" was, & even after I did I still forgot. It's nothing against Traxas, as I know they've been great for this sport. It's just that serious racers never get a chance to even see some cars. The only Traxas vehicle's I've ever seen are a couple of Nitro rustlers & 1 Tmax. I just don't get to see them. I also don't get around on road cars, simply because I've never had one, & may never have one. That's nothing against them either. Everbody just needs to be a little more tolerant of each other. It's hard to know everything about all the vehicles unless you own a hobby shop or are named Steve Pond! :D ;)

[Railman]

I forgot to add my $.02 on motor break in, in the above reply.
The thing is is that a motor without fully seated brushes will arc more. Therefore it will make a little less power under heavy loads & SLIGHTLY increase the amount of com wear due to the increased arcing. As said above by many it doesn't take a lot to break them in. If your not racing just run it easy for about 1/2 of a batt pack & you'll be good to go. It's actually braking thats hardest on the comm, try to minimize braking durring breakin. Just my $.02

[jeepinator]

How do you spell that ?
Haleliujah ?

Oh, heheh, I just looked it up: hallelujah

So, without further ado ....
HALLELUJA !!!

I have been vindicated not once but TWICE. Hey Howie, where you been buddy ? You can pull your head out of the sand now, we can still be friends ! ;)

Oh yeah, and thanks Railman. Hey Railman, what does the name signify ? Do you have a sand rail ? My buddy has one. Holy cow they are fun !

[HauntedMyst]

Whats Traxxas?

[Railman]

Jeep, No sand rail, I wish I did though. It's what I do for $. I manufacture Pre- finished, preassembled wood railings for new homes. I've had people guess it meant railroad, drag cars, & now a sand rail! Went online & did a search for "Railman" & it came up as some company that installs highway gardrails! Who'd a thunk it?

By the way I wasn't trying to vindicate anyone, just adidding my $.02! :D

[maxxxracer]

so haunted myst, hmmm... www.traxxas.com (http://www.traxxas.com) :p