Integy motors on Ebay - BEWARE !

[jeepinator]

Hello,
I bought an Integy motor off of Ebay a while ago. I finally got around to openning it up and checking it out.
Here is what I found (trying to be factual here):
1) The comm, as measured by my expensive calipers, is .2870". This is crazy! Since I am not a performance nut (meaning that I balance performance with other attributes), this concerns me.
2) It is CLEARLY and machine wound motor
3) Not epoxy ballanced
4) No included capacitors

So, here is the auction, so you have the full unbiased story: CLICK HERE (http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1625359555&ed=997738950)

And here is a pic of the arm, for proof:

http://www.theshreves.com/pics/armature.jpg

What do you all think of this ?
Was the motor misrepresented ?
Was this auction deceptive in any way ?
Is this wise motor philosophy (to cut the comm this small for a new motor) ?
What do you think of Integy allowing these to be out on the gray market ?

Thanks for any input !

[ 09-01-2001: Message edited by: jeepinator ]

[Grizzbob]

Well, that one's in a bit of a grey area. The seller isn't exactly lying, he's just repeating word for word what Integy's ads say, but to be honest, I've never trusted the quality of their products(some can be fine, while others are definitely NOT up to par). Mass production is all they really care about, so they do cut some corners. In the case of their motors, it's possible that those are hand-wound, but if the guy who wound it is hurrying or just not very good then it'll likely look like it was machine wound(doing it right is very time consuming, that's why good hand-wounds cost so much more),which also makes it harder to balance properly(hence all the drilling in that arm, drill balancing is quicker than epoxy balancing). As for the comm diameter, it may be that they built & tuned one particular motor of a batch, & that was the diameter that they thought performed the best on the dyno, so they probably cut all the comms of the batch to the same diameter & set them all up identically, whether it works for them all or not. Once again, as I said it is possible that you can find good strong motors from them, but I still don't consider them to be much of a reputable builder or tuner. That's why I usually recommend Fantom to most people, I know the owner of the company, & he DEFINITELY knows his stuff & as a result I've never seen or heard of anyone getting a bad motor from them. I know they cost more than Integy, but to me they're worth the money, & you know the old saying eBay puts on every page...."caveat emptor"(Let the buyer beware). Most times, you do get what you pay for..... :)

[daramirez]

What is the standard/average measurement of a comm? I'm guessing diameter since you used calipers right?

Thanks.

[Oyster]

Whoa whoa... I highly doubt this is an Integy Motor. EVERY motor, and arm I've gotten from Integy has been very good. In fact, the arms are fantastic. I would say this is a used arm someone put into an Integy can.

I've seen these Ebay runnings. They are using the Integy Pictures, which is illegal, and now, sending these non Integy Motors out.

Buyer Beware. What was the name of the seller?

- jon

[jeepinator]

This motor came in a sealed Integy package.
If you want to know who the seller is, click on the link I provided.

I understand the risks there are on Ebay, and I am not claiming I got screwed. I am only sharing my experience with you, so that you may make better decisions.

[Usagi]

anything can be opened and resealed. I have had this and many more from even with my LHS. There is noting you can do. SOme people buy the product get it home play around switch things and then reseal it and get a exchange.
Its happen to me. :o

[Railman]

Jeep, Integy used to cut their coms to a small diameter like that years ago. I remember guys at the track ranting & raving about trashing their motors in just a few races. The huge balancing holes are usually a result of someone making a mistake in the initial stage of balancing & then redrilling to correct. Ever see an arm with all three poles driiled? It shouldn't happen, because it only takes two poles drilled to to get it balanced. I have also seen arms that were obviously drilled on the wrong end of the pole 1st, & then drilled on the opposite end with an even bigger crater to make up for it.
It's not too hard to look at the windings & see that the windings are shifted way to the outside on one end, & yet the holes will be on the opposite end sometimes. I know that static & dynamic balancing are two different things, but I also know that a dynamic balance should still check out to be good on a static balancer. :rolleyes: This is not the case with some arms that I've seen.
As far as whether it's new or not, look at the shaft. I doesn't appear to have any wear pattern on it. It should have some even on a ball bearing. It could just be a lemon!
Jeep, that's just another good reason to buy from an LHS. Joe

[ 09-01-2001: Message edited by: Railman ]

[Oyster]

I still say, this is not a true Integy motor. Even though you don't think so, I say you got screwed. I'd report this person to Integy.

- jon

[jeepinator]

OK, well here is my post on Integy's BBS:
http://www.integy.com/ubb/Forum11/HTML/000115.html

I am curious to see the reaction. Any bets I get attitude and snyde remarks like, "That's what you get when buying on Ebay". My point is clearly not that I feel I got hosed, or that I want revenge or something.

I simply want folks to know whats out there and who is selling it.
As a bonus I would love to know why there are MANY *brand new* Integy motors on Ebay at any given time. Where are they coming from ?


Oh ya, and look at the seller ... he is currently selling ONLY Integy stuff !
How interesting! Here is the sellers current list: http://cgi6.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewListedItems&userid=buckblaster2&include=0&since=-1&sort=2&rows=25

[ 09-01-2001: Message edited by: jeepinator ]

[RichieRich]

Jeep!!! You're supposed to do the research BEFORE you purchase. :D I don't think you got screwed, you just paid retail price for a standard low end machine wound modified. It's okay, just don't let it happen again. We're here for you bro. ;)

[ 09-02-2001: Message edited by: RichieRich ]

[Oyster]

Well, perhaps I spoke too soon. Integy has said that what Jeep bought was a "low end motor" - Come on.. I've boughten low end motors before, and they all had some meat left on the comm. I still say something is screwy, but.. not sure who is screwy.

I still stand by the hand wound Integy motors. I have two of them sitting in my "Rc garage", and they are beautiful.

Mainly, I'm sorry you got screwed, Jeep. Had you bought this motor from me, you'd have your money back! :)

- jon

[jeepinator]

Hey, you don't need to feel sorry for me!
I am aware of the risks, yada yada yada. I don't even feel sorry for me :p

As far as getting screwed ...
I think that seller is going to hate me pretty soon. I am sending every bidder (bidding on this same motor he keeps selling over and over) a nice little message ;) I am sending it through the Ebay messaging interface so they will have copies as well.

EVIL JEEPINATOR HAS ARRIVED !

Here is the message I am sending them:

Hello,
I have purchased an Integy motor from this seller.
After receiving it I openned it up and found it to be MACHINE wound budget modified motor. While the seller makes no claim that it is a hand wound motor, the auction is, at the very least, deceiving.
I have confirmed the above statement with Integy directly. You see my question, and the response here: http://www.integy.com/ubb/Forum11/HTML/000115.html

Here is the auction (for proof) that I have purchased a motor fromn this seller: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1625359555&ed=997738950

Good luck and have a nice day !


Anyone have any improvements to this message ?

[Usagi]

I hate to tell you this. But he is using the products and resealing them and selling as new! I seen it once, i seen its a 100 times. ;)

[HowieStern]

as stated above... "this is just another good reason to buy from an LHS"... no kidding...

you say you aren't complaining about buying off of E-bay, but you really are.... fork out the extra 5 bucks and buy from your LHS....

you really Should have known better...

peace out... :)

[Nairb]

I disagree. ebay is really a GREAT place to get good stuff for a great price, if and when you get lucky. Sure, sometimes people are looking to make a buck by scamming people, but if you are careful on what you go after, you'll usually be safe. Just last week I got two BRAND NEW Ti mods (10x2 and 12x2) off ebay for the price of one at my LHS. Tell me the last time my LHS had a "buy one, get one free" deal on brand new, current-model motors... I'd say NEVER. I've got quite a few great deals on ebay, and the fact that this kind of thing sometimes happens doesn't make me want to stop using ebay. It only makes me more cautious of what I bid on. Sometimes you can get away with a great deal, but a lot of times you would have to pay close to regular price to win, and then it's not usually worth it. As ebay says, "Buyer Beware." There's no more advice I need.

[mavrick0611]

i bught the same motor on e-bay but 10x3 turns from a different seller. I got to tell ya the RPM is way down. i wont buy another Integy motor i dont know as long as it works and i can gear it high i dont care.
aj

[Nairb]

For the record, yes, I think that seller was borderline dishonest in his product description. I'm sure he only said what he wanted to get the most money out of the bidders. I don't like that, but it's bound to happen in this type of venue.

About the seriously-small diameter comm, I'm not sure what to think. I agree with Railman that it looks unused, but I don't see why a company would justify cutting the comm THAT much on a brand new motor. It smells fishy to me...

I certainly see those "Brand new" Integy Mods on ebay all the time, and I've never thought much about buying one. However, I recently won a brand new "Integy D4 mod" from a guy called "kevenlove" that also sells a lot of new Integy motors. I got it for $31, which is definitely a sweet deal for a D4. I'll definitely be inspecting it as soon as I get it (probably tomorrow). I hope that since it's supposed to be a D4 mod, it will be top-notch quality like I expect.

Wanna hear about another sweet deal I got on ebay recently? How about a BRAND NEW, never used Airtronics 94357 servo for $75? I bought my other one at my LHS for $110, and that was a good price. Also, I got an Integy Reactor 30 amp discharger for $26; it goes for $45 on Integy's website. ebay ROCKS IMHO, ladies and gentlemen. I'm definitely not scared off by this story (I know that's not your point, Todd ;)).

[jeepinator]

For the 3rd time, I am not complaining. The motor has actually turned out to be a great motor. It is a bit slow for a 10 turn, but it stayed cool and I got great run time out of it.
I put 11 runs on it, end to end, no stopping 2 nights ago at a local track. I like the motor. And, most importanntly, I will be buying more stuff on Ebay. I have spent quite a bit of money on Ebay, and this is the first case that I felt even remotely deceived.
My ONLY purpose for posting is to promote the "buyer beware" mentality, nothing more.

[Nairb]

I'm completely with ya, buddy (and you know it)! My posts were mainly for the non-believers out there... ;)

[HowieStern]

you are complaining or why would this thread have ever been started??

everyone else here ALREADY knows to be careful when you buy anything from a private person over the net.... it seems you don't realize that.... you got burnt, then started complaining....

if you would have simply went down to your LHS, you could go right up there, face to face, the same day and gotten the situation corrected...

you get what you pay for off ebay... and sometimes you even get more, like RIPPED off... just don't come whining here when you SHOULD have known better...

peace out.... :)

[jeepinator]

Howie, do I have to make you look like an idiot, AGAIN ? :D

And I thought you learned your lesson the first time. Shall I recall a certain thread ? I dare you to do it ... go ahead be a man :p

Heheh, I got your number this time. Clearly you cannot know my intentions. Do you read minds ? LOL!
HOWIE THE MIND READER! LOL! I can just see you squinting your eyes going ... what is he thinking ... hehehe.

Come on little buddy you can do better than that. I am not even remotely aggrevated yet. Oh, unless you are gonna mind read me on that too (LOL!).

PEACE DUDE :)

[Nairb]

LOL! SOMEBODY REALLY wants to prove somebody else wrong...and I'm not talking about Jeep... :p You won't do it, little buddy. Jeep's a very careful (not to mention cool) guy. You're barking up the wrong tree...

[Usagi]

Like I said,I had problems like his from my LHS. I does not matter if its mail order house or LHS.

[jeepinator]

Hey Howie, what am I thinking right now ?

[JP]

Smaller comms produce more RPM, and arent the most uncommon thing. But i dont think yours is normal, or right... :(

[juliogsr]

Jeepinator: I have used (and sell) Integy products for a long time. You definately have a "Low End" motor.

I can guarantee that if you get an Integy Team Armature (wich is handwound) put it into a Yokomo or Fantom (Epic) can with Yokomo brushes you will have a freaking fast motor!

You were simply sold a crappy lemon (maybe used) motor.

[nitroboy2001]

temperature treated commutator pre-cut to a racing size that produce maximum punch, Xipp Super Lathe diamond-true each commutator to a brilliant, mirror finish Ok this is out of the ebay post, it means its cut for a smaller comm, to produce higher amount of punch, the smaller the comm on the armature the more punch the motor has, but that doesn't look to be hand wound