Is this a good plane?

[kingsnake93]

Is this a good plane? Can it do a knife-edge?

http://www.raidentech.com/4timorcbirar.html

[hobbico99]

for $99.00 i dont think its a good plane and about the knife edge it probably would do it if the cheap servo doesnt strip

[Leo L]

In most cases you get what you pay for.

[JJFlash]

I think thisis the same plane. I got one and it flys good. I had to set the control horns to outer holes because I'm not a 3D flyer. Got mine for about $40 + $20 shipping off ebay.
http://cgi.ebay.com/4-Channel-RTF-3D-Tiger-Moth-Electric-R-C-Airplane-RC_W0QQitemZ6050906647QQcategoryZ2563QQssPageNameZ WDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[aeajr]

Is this a good plane? Can it do a knife-edge?

http://www.raidentech.com/4timorcbirar.html

Good plane? Good for what purpose?

In the hands of an experienced pilot, a poor plane can be made to fly well. In the hands of a new pilot it can be made into junk in seconds.

Are you an experienced pilot who is ready for agressive manauvers? That seems to be what this plane is intended for. But I would not call it a good beginner plane.

Here are the RTF planes I recommend for beginners, which is what your question leads me to believe you are.

READY TO FLY STARTER PLANES - Electric Parkflyers
No building - they practically fly right out of the box
These also glide well so you can thermal soar
with them under the right conditions.


Slow-V from Parkzone - $140 -
Best flown in still to under 5 mph breeze. This is the best choice for
people who only have a small space to fly or who have an indoor
place to fly, such as a large gym or similar space.
http://h1071118.hobbyshopnow.com/products/description.asp?prod=PKZ1300
Discussion Thread
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_2074785/anchors_2089493/mpage_1/key_/anchor/tm.htm#2089493
Review
http://www.rcuniverse.com/magazine/article_display.cfm?article_id=426
Video
http://users.cwnet.com/dhsc19/Slo_V_Aerobatics.wmv
Night fly module on a Slo-V
http://rc-galaxy.com/messageboard/mb.asp?M=Slow_Flyers&CMD=ViewMsg&num=-8

T-Hawk - RTF - Excellent Value - $150-170
Comes with extra wing, tail and battery
Flies well and stands up to hard landings
Can be flown on 27 MHz or 72 MHz
http://www.toytx.com/thawk3chrtf.html
T-Hawk - Without Radio - add your radio and receiver
http://www.readytoflyfun.com/wittran.html
T-Hawk Discussion Thread
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=243202&highlight=THawk
Videos
http://www.readytoflyfun.com/thawkvideos.html

Easy Star - RTF - $170
Believe this goes easily back in the box to keep in the car
Super tough foam. Comes with 72 MHz radio in the US.
Good parkflyer and a good glider
Radio in RTF package can be used to fly other planes
http://www.hobbypeople.net/gallery/240025.asp
Easy Star - ARF - Add you own radio gear
http://www.hobbypeople.net/gallery/240009.asp
Amazing information site for easy star
http://www.mpx-easystar.de/
Videos
http://plawner.org/video/easygo.wmv
http://plawner.org/video/easystar.wmv
Mods, upgrades and more
http://www.mpx-easystar.de/
Adding ailerons
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=350408&goto=newpost
Travel Box
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=468625&goto=newpost

Aerobird Challenger - RTF Electric - $110 -
I started on an Aerobird RTF. I have over 600 flights on my Aerobirds. I
also thermal and slope soar this plane. Flies well and stands up to hard
landings.
Their add on fun accessories for night flying, air to air combat and drop
module
add to the fun! Great keep in the car plane - take off the wing and it goes
back in the box fully assembled. Most can't do that!
http://www.hobbyzone.com/rc_planes_hobbyzone_aerobird_challenger.htm
Review
http://www.hobbyzonesports.com/Discover/Articles.aspx?ArticleID=1289#Page01
Discussion Thread
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=147621
Video
http://www.parkflyers.com/html/aerobird_video.html
http://www.hobbyzone.com/rc_videos/aerobird_challenger_loops.wmv

Hobbico Sky Fly - $100
I haveflown this one personally. About the best landing gear and ground
handling of the planes I list here
NOTE: Radio range is only 500 feet. This is adequate if you are careful
but about 1/4 of the range of the others listed here.
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXKLV7&P=ML
Video
http://video1.hobbico.com/gallery/hcaa1960-1961-deluxe.mpg
Review
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=489248
Discussion thread
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=493271&pp=15

If you have questions, feel free to ask. :)

[Leo L]

Ed,
If I recall correctly, Kingsnake started flying last summer with a Firebird Comander. He then tried a Freedom, but found it to be too fast and got a Slow-V. He has gotten comfortable with the Slow-V and is looking to upgrade. He also got his dad interested in flying, which is terrific. I believe that he is overly ambitious with the planes that he is now looking at. I believe that he has gotten quite good on the simulator and believes that his skill level has dramatically improved. One of the down sides of relying too much on a simulator. I hope that he settles for a good intermediate plane, that will be challenging and fun to fly, but will not be so far over his head that he will get discouraged or will totally wipe out the plane.

[kingsnake93]

I never had a freedom. When I last flew the firebirdcommander2 (a long time ago) I thought it was getting slower. Or maybe I though it was slow? Then whats a good intermediate 4 channel plane?

[aeajr]

Kingsnake,

You REALLY have to provide more info in your questions. Good for WHAT?

This is a great plane. It will do a knife edge. It costs $2000 for the ARF
http://www.desertaircraft.com/page.php?Page=ZNLineAircraft
http://www.desertaircraft.com/images/toc_2000/leroux1.jpg

You must always state your flying experience, your budget, your goal for the plane and what radio you plan to use to fly it. If it has to be an RTF, say so. If you are still very much a beginner, how much space and whether you will have help would be very very important. Only then can anyone give you useful information.

This is a good plane. It will do a knife edge. The ARF costs $89
You better know how to fix balsa and apply covering if you crack it up.
To get it to full potential will need at least a 7 channel mid range sport compute radio with 4 wing servo programming.
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=EFL2250

Have I made my point? I am trying to help you understand how to ask a question so that others can help you.

Good as a next step up from a Commander? A good plane for someone who still crashes every 4th landing? What means good?

Sorry to be a pain but you provide very little info with your questions so you can expect the quality and accuracy of the answers to be of the same level.

I will describe soem planes that are good for someone who has at least a 4 channel standard radio and is prepared to take on a modest build. I assume an aileron trainer type plane that is stable and can take a FEW hard hits.

I assume a modest budget of $100 or less for the plane, without electroncis, is a good price range. I will list good planes that meet these criteria.

These planes might be able to do a knife edge, but I doubt they will win any competitions doing it.

Magpie -
I recommend the $55 package with two wings.
Has slow fly/trainer wing AND an aileron sport wing.
Master the first, then advance to the second.
They offer a complete package with both wings and all the electroncis for
$160
Makes it so easy to get it right!
http://www.mountainmodels.com/magpie.php
discussion threads
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3502851#post3502851
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=295225
Video - slow fly wing
http://www.mountainmodels.com/Magpie.wmv
Sport wing
http://www.mountainmodels.com/MagpieSP.wmv

GWS E-starter 400 - Simple Foam Kit - $50
http://www.gwsexpert.com/product_info.php?products_id=551
Available as a ARF complete package kit with radio - $150
http://www.gwsexpert.com/product_info.php?cPath=56&products_id=611

GWS Tiger Moth 400 - Simple Foam Kit - $70
http://www.gwsexpert.com/product_info.php?cPath=2_54&products_id=203
Complete kit including Radio - $175
http://www.gwsexpert.com/product_info.php?cPath=34&products_id=658
Review
http://www.rcuniverse.com/magazine/article_display.cfm?article_id=345
Video
http://67.18.81.100/rcuvideos/magazine/reviews/345/TM400m.wmv

Multiplex Magister ARF - $110
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXGZV2&P=ML
Multiplex Magister - RTF - $299
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXGZV3&P=ML
This plane is much larger than the others
Close to a .40 glow trainer in size
Reviews
http://www.smoothair.ca/reviews/Magister/magister.htm
http://www.rcuniverse.com/magazine/article_display.cfm?article_id=519
Going busheless
http://www.rcuniverse.com/magazine/article_display.cfm?article_id=621
Discussion
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=309397
Touch and Gos
http://www.plawner.org/video/magister_touchngoes.wmv
Video - Take off from grass - standard motor/battery
http://67.18.81.100/rcuvideos/magazine/reviews/519/magister1.wmv
Towing up a glider
http://plawner.org/video/Magister_easy.wmv
Video - This is not with the standard motor
this plane has an upgraded brushless motor
http://plawner.org/video/magister_test.wmvhttp://plawner.org/video/magister_test.wmv

These are some good planes for the purpose I described.

[kingsnake93]

Ok. I have been flying my slow-V and I am getting bored with that one. I dont consider myself a complete beginner but when I get my next plane I want a more hard plane to fly. I consider myself advanced beginner. I want somthing thats a 4 channel rtf trainer for about 200-250$. I have about a 600x600' space to fly in.

[aeajr]

Great!

And I saw in another post you are getting a DX6. Outstanding!

Considering you are getting your own radio, I don't know why you would want another RTF, but here are a couple to consider.

F27-Stryker - RTF - $170
This is not a 4 channel plane but it is an aileron plane via the elevons. Tons of fun to fly! Rugged too. Will fly at a good clip but will slow down as well. Get a freind to get one of these, or one of the other parkzone or Hobbyzone planes that has an X port and you can fly air to air combat. Cool!
Fun Keep-in-the-car plane
Just pop off the tail fins and it goes back in the box!!!!!
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdId=PKZ1200
Discussion
http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=233
Video
http://rc-galaxy.com/Video/F-27_Stryker_Richard_Harris_7-9-04.wmv
http://www.horizonhobby.com/ProdInfo/Files/Parkzone_F027_Stryker_240x180_nb.wmv
http://www.break.com/index/planenuts9.html
Review
http://www.rcuniverse.com/magazine/article_display.cfm?article_id=392


Multiplex Space Scooter - RTF
This plane comes 3 channel with ailerons/elevator/throttle, but you can add the rudder later if you like. Elapor foam is very resiliant and this one is reported to fly ver well.
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXGZV5&P=7
ARF
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXGZV4&P=7
Review
http://www.rcuniverse.com/magazine/article_display.cfm?article_id=548
Video
http://www.bungymania.com/videos/films/spacescooter/spacescooter_sun_stunt.wmv
http://67.18.81.100/rcuvideos/magazine/reviews/548/SpaceScooter.wmv

Multiplex Magister - RTF - $299
If you want to try something larger and heavier, this one will require take off from the ground. It will handle wind better than the lighter parkflyers.
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXGZV3&P=ML
This plane is much larger than the others
Close to a .40 glow trainer in size


BeginAir - RTF or Receiver ready
Have not flown one but reports say it is at least OK, and some like it a lot.
RTF - $180 Receiver Ready - $110
http://www.parkflyers.com/html/begin-air.html
Review
http://www.rcuniverse.com/magazine/article_display.cfm?article_id=443
video
http://67.18.81.100/rcuvideos/magazine/reviews/443/BeginAir.wmv
Discussion Thread
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=445663

Cesna 182 - 4 Channel RTF - $180
Nice looking EPS plane. Not as resiliant as the others but if you are ready to advance your landing skills should bring this one in smoothly.
http://www.ewebcart.com/cgi-bin/cart.pl?merchant=3210&add=1&item_id=144
Includes 72 MHz radio and wall charger.
Sku# 4303 $179.99 4 Channel with 72 MHz Radio
(Intermediate Level Recommended)
Video
http://www.parkflyers.com/html/cessna_long_movie.html

[kingsnake93]

I like the Multiplex Magister. I might save up for that. My birthday is july 25th. I want a 4 channel trainer so when I get a plane with my dx6 I wont crash it. I am thinking about asking for the e-flight cessna 182. Or the air liner jumbo jet thing from e-flight.

[aeajr]

http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=EFL2200
Is this the plane you are thinking of getting? $69
Nice plane. Don't know anyting about it. Your DX6 servos and receiver should be a good fit.

Just add the recommended brushless motor and controller - $90
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=EFLA311B
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/RelatedPartsSummary.aspx?ProdID=EFL2200

And a couple of Lipoly packs - $90
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=EFLB1016

And the charger of course $45
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=EFLC3005

And you will be all set. :p

[kingsnake93]

If I dont get the Multiplex Magister the cessna 182 will be my first trike gear. Is there anything I need to know about landing on a trike gear?

[aeajr]

I understand that people feel it is easier than landing a tail dragger, but I don't do much runway flying so most of my planes are belly landed. No landing gear at all. :)

[HottsOne]

Keep the nose up until you have burnt off enough airspeed that it will settle...Would hate to see you lose a prop so easily.

P.S. I went from Aerobird Commander to Challenger to Xtreme to the Art-Tech 540 Edge. You can get a complete airframe from www.awlhobbies.com for around $60.00 just use your DX6 (that is what I use) and get a good motor, battery and charger Oh yeah, and an ESC.

[aeajr]

If I dont get the Multiplex Magister the cessna 182 will be my first trike gear. Is there anything I need to know about landing on a trike gear?

Be aware that the safe range on a DX 6 is between 1500 and 2000 feet. If you push the Magister way out you could get it out of range so just be aware of this. Not likely but it could happen. It is large enough that if it starts to get small it will be near the edge of the radio's range.

[HottsOne]

I learn something new everyday Aeajr....Never looked close enough at my DX6 to see what the range was. LOL. I can say with some confidence however, that I think you are safe just outside of that. Atleast where I live.

[kingsnake93]

The range of my slow-v is 2500 feet. I bet a mager brand radio could go alot farther.

[HottsOne]

I think AEAJR is speaking in Lawyers terms. In other words, what is written on the box to CTOA (cover their own A$$) Which I can't blame them with the way the world is today.

[hobbico99]

The range of my slow-v is 2500 feet. I bet a mager brand radio could go alot farther.
its a major brand radio but its is made for park flyers and helicopters being on the 2.4ghz in stead of 72mhz that makes a difference

[kingsnake93]

The slow-v is a parkflyer.

[kingsnake93]

I am not going to ask for the e-flight cessna after all. instead I am going to ask for a Dx6 and a brushless motor and a ESC. To cinvert my slow-v to a 4 channel brushless slow flyer (It wont be slow for long) Do you think it would work? What battery should I use?

[aeajr]

I think AEAJR is speaking in Lawyers terms. In other words, what is written on the box to CTOA (cover their own A$$) Which I can't blame them with the way the world is today.

Actually HotsOne is mistaken on this one.

There is no range claim on the box or in the manual for the DX6.

This is not like you slo-V 27 mhz radio or even a typical 72 mhz radio. This is 2.4 GHz spread spectrum system. A totally new technology that is very exciting and I highly recommend it to people who are dedicated to small electrics. It is also good for small hand launch and slope gliders that are in the 60" or lower wing span ranges.

The idea that a major brand radio means long range is a dangerous one. You should NEVER assume such things.

Hitec, Futaba, GWS and others that you would think of a MAJOR brands all sell receivers that have ranges that are a LOT less then your Slo-V and they all sell receivers that have a LOT more range than your Slo-V. Never assume range without checking or you will be buying a lot of new planes as yours go off into the sunset. Range is primrily a function of the receiver, not the transmitter, for most radio systems.

The DX6 has been shown to work out to about 3000+ feet. But I would NOT want to depend on that. I use 1500-2000 feet as the range for this system. This would be a much more reliable and safer range to consider as your working range. If you slip past to 2500', you are probably fine. IBut if you are planning to fly out at 3000 feet as the normal flying area, and conditions occur that will shorten your range, you are dead!

The true range on most of my Hitec receivers is probably over 2 miles, but the rated range is 1 mile. This is completely normal as a way of rating radio systems that provide remote control. BTW, that is part of the reason that the AMA recommends 3 miles between club fields, because the true range of the radio systems can be far more than the rated range and you don't want flyers at one field crashing planes at the other.

Consider that 1500-2000 feet is like 5-7 football fields away. Even a Magister starts to get small and orientation can become challenging at that range. Oh, there is no doubt that you can fly the Magister at 3000 feet, but why? If you fly from the middle of your field, and consider 2000 feet your range limit, then you have a circle with a diamater of 4000 feet around you in which to fly. That is plenty!

Only sailplane pilots, and those flying giants really need more range than that. I know, I am a sailplane pilot and, when working a thermal, I can have my plane 1000 feet up and out 3/4 of a mile, say 4000', or further. But they have 10 foot wing spans and are made for this kind of flying. I use receivers rated at 1 mile+ in these planes.

Thousands of parkflyers are flown with receivers with 500'-1000' range with no problems. 1500 feet left, and 1500 feet right, 10 foot ball fields, is plenty of range and typically larger than most flying fields.

The DX6 will be fine for you. Get it and never worry about channel conflict or interference.

[HottsOne]

Aeajr,

Please do not take my comment as a jab, it was more of a poke to the ribs (as a joke). I went home and looked on the box last night.......nothing there about range. I do agree however, that the DX6 being made for park flyers does not need the long range as it (for me anyway) does not make flying any more fun when you consider not being able to see your small plane in comparison to a giant scale.

To any end, the DX6 is a great park flyer radio in my opinion and is truley a big advance in radion technology especially with all the new RTF's coming out on 72 MHz and the remaining 27MHz-49MHz radios which could interfere with your bird. I fugure, the safer you can fly, the safer it is for others who may not yet know that you have a plane in the air (for those who do not fly at an AMA field).

[aeajr]

Aeajr,

Please do not take my comment as a jab, it was more of a poke to the ribs (as a joke).

No offense taken, and watch where you poke, I am very tickelish. :D

I feel the DX6 is probably the perfect radio for the electric flyer. If I were looking for a radio for my electric planes, this would definately be the radio I would get.

In fact Hitec has advised they will be releasing a 2.4 ghz module for the Optic 6, Prism 7X and Eclipse 7. It is guestimated that we will see it in the fall. It will also be certified in my Futaba 9C, so you KNOW what Daddy is going to want for Christmas. :)

Get that DX6 and fly in confidence. :cool: