what is betta ,-- MVP VS. P2K

[b3buggydude05]

what is better in the performance these performance areas :(mvp and p2k)


speed?
torque?
power?
quality?

all together?

[Nairb]

Dude, go for an MVP. I totally dig mine. I use it in my XXXT instead of the P2K Pro and Chrome stock RS that are in my box. My second choice would be the Chrome Stock. I have every bit as much power with my MVP as I do with the others (at the same gearing, 18/88), but way more top end RPMs.

[HowieStern]

yo nair... arent you the guy that was telling people to go out and buy MVP's and Profi radios while you had yours on order and hadn't even tried them yet?? just wondering...

i have 3 MVP's... my personal opinion is that they are the worst stock motor to hit the market in the last 5 years... they are fickle, run hot, and have Zero punch out of the corners... tweaking and tuning seems to have little effect.... some people love'em... but not one single person i race with uses them... we all use P-2-k's or Green Machine 3's.....

peace out... :)

[Leet TC3]

Sometimes I think Howie must race in the Twilight Zone.

Everything you said runs counter to what is generally agreed upon elsewhere. Including the "everyone I know races with other motors".

I race with some of the best racers in the world. ALL have switched to MVP's. NONE of these guys are factory sponsored (although if they wanted that job, they could easily have it) so they are not beholden to Reedy for commercial reasons.

NOBODY else has posted the things you said about the MVP. Sure, they run hot, but so what? "No punch coming out of the corners?". If that's what you think, you have gotten a real bad batch of MVP's, or there is something seriously wrong with your setup.

This is not meant to flame you. We are each entitled to our opinions. But don't come on here and make blanket statements, passing it off as generally accepted facts, when in FACT you are the ONLY one disseminating this information.

[staggsracing]

I have run them all back to back. I run the Pro versions of each and do not do any "tweaking" of my own. The MVP works the best for me in real world testing - racing. Also, my MVP does not really get too hot. You need to gear them right just like any other motor.

[ 07-16-2001: Message edited by: staggsracing ]

[noobie]

My MVPs seem to be giving more power than the P2Ks I see, but I could be wrong. Where I notice it most is coming out of the corners, actually. I am geared below the P2Ks, so that makes sense. I do keep up on the straight with no trouble, though. I am running offroad truck stock. I not sponsored or anything. I couldn't get sponsored if I owned Reedy or Trinity. LOL

[Nairb]

Howie, don't dismiss me as some kid throwing out questionable information, because I'm not. I didn't reccomend an MVP before I had mine. Honestly, it helped me win the stock truck points series at my track. I have loads of torque to clear the jumps easily and I honestly catch (and even pass) guys on the straightaway all the time. Maybe I got lucky and bought an extra powerful MVP...whatever...my experience is all true.


The only change I've made to my MVP is replacing the negative spring with a slightly softer one from my old Midnight. I use the stock brushes and still haven't needed to get the comm cut; the brushes are that nice to the comm. I do know that a comm stick can make a big difference after a couple race days. This is the deal. If you use the stock (766) brushes, you'll have great performance and the comm & brushes will last you a long time. If you replace them with 767s and use the same springs, you might get a little more performance, but the comm and brushes won't last half as long. Seriously. Try it and you'll see. I'm sticking with 766s.

As for the Profi, I've had mine for months, and I still think it's the best radio out there, in my honest opinion. I absolutely love the radio and see no reason I shouldn't share my recommendations and advice about it.

I think I'm qualified to give advice on stock motors, because I've owned and raced almost every one on the market in the last 6 months. First, I replaced my old Midnight & Midnight 2 with two GM3s. They both burned up, even when I geared them way low. Next, I got a P2K Pro. It was strong, but I was getting smoked on the straightaway. I bought an Orion Chrome Stock RS. It was stronger and had more RPMs than my P2K (I had them dynoed). I also got a brand new Warlock WFO (Epic Paradox-based) when I bought my buggy. It had loads of RPMs, but not loads of torque. I saved it for my buggy, and I'm glad to say that I'm performing great with it, too. I have plenty of torque to clear the jumps, plenty of punch out of the corners, and I still have more speed on the straightaway than a lot of guys. My Chrome was my favorite motor for my XXXT until I got my MVP. This baby is powerful and FAST. I gear it the same (18/88) as my P2K and Chrome, but it still has plenty of torque and loads of speed. I'll be keeping it in my truck indefinitely...

There you have it, Nairb's stock motor review... :)

[Grizzbob]

I'd tend to agree with Nairb, I've tried EVERY stock motor available for the last 12 years(& I've also been doing some extensive dyno testing recently), & I have to say I'm impressed with the MVP. I wouldn't say its a perfect motor(it does get pretty darn hot, but it seems to just keep cranking out the power regardless), but with some tuning it can really match the best P2K's in every category, & still beat them on top end. However, I'm not really inclined to recommend them to those with little experience, because they do require some care tuning & gearing them, while the P2K is still about THE easiest stock motor to live with(they'll definitely take the most gearing abuse). Really the biggest thing to consider when choosing a motor is what kind of track you run on & what vehicle you run. If you need lots of speed & need to carry that speed through corners then a Green Machine 3 may be your best bet, but if your track is really tight & has pretty short straights then a P2K could be the better choice. But for medium sized tracks with a mix of tight corners & decent straights the MVP could be the motor to beat.... :)

[HowieStern]

i was stating my personal opinion..... (as it clearly stated right at the start of my post...) .... but heck YES... it is fact to ME, because that is what i have seen in the field with that particular motor....

but... beleive it or not.... it (my opinion) very well may be different than yours... if you don't like my opinion... that is your problem, not mine... that's what boards are for... getting different opinions from different users....

we have posted a couple threads on how to improve low end and lower temps, Grizz left some really good info, but all you other motor "guru's" seemed to have passed it up... i'm sure all the "best" drivers in the world should know a speed secret or two right?? LOL...

now....

i drive both B-3's and T-3's... both are FT's... both use C-2's.... both use Dean's Plugs and Dean's 12 gauge wiring...

both use Step-pins (the hot set-up for the track i race on)... and i use both robinson spurs and pinions.... my trannies are cleaned weakly... and my diffs are rebuilt every 2 weeks... i used sealed bearing through-out... and they also get a weekly cleaning....

i have run anywhere from 18-87 to 22-87 on my truck.... and 17-81 to 21- 81 gearing on my buggy with MVP's... i have used narrowed brushes... both reedy 767's and Trinity E-brushes... and i have also tried the "light" blue colored Paradox springs.... which seemed to keep temps in check... but still didn't seem to have much low end punch...

last weekend in my first heat i gave my Dillon pro-tuned MVP another shot... it was in my buggy with 19/81 gearing... it had a fresh turn on the comm, and brand new reedy 767 brushes.... cells were 1.15 B & T 2400's.....

it was down on top end speed with that gearing, and around the 4 minute mark it really started losing power.... i didn't want to gear any higher for fear of melting the back half of my buggy off... LOL.. after the heat we used a Raytec temp gun to measure can temp... it was 260 degrees... (the temp outside was around 85 degrees with high humidity..)

my second heat i used a Fantom LTD P-2-K with 21/81 gearing... it had more top-end, and more punch out of the corners... after that race, we measured can temp in the same manner, and it was 168.....

if any of you guys get a chance this weekend... borrow your nitro buddies Raytec and shoot your can ASAP after a race with your MVP's and Epics.... i was not shooting the endbell... just at the mid-point of the can.... it would be interesting to learn just what kind of temps you guys are getting....

peace out.... :)

[Leet TC3]

Uhhh, sure thing Howie. Is that why you started out your first post with a thinly veiled flame?

my personal opinion is that they are the worst stock motor to hit the market in the last 5 years...

The worst stock motor? The WORST stock motor? That may be your opinion, but I highly doubt it. That kind of blanket statement sounds more like you have some personal vendetta against Reedy.

What next Howie, are you gonna say the TC3 is the WORST 4wd sedan on the market in the past 5 years?

they are fickle, run hot, and have Zero punch out of the corners...

Zero punch coming out of corners? ZERO punch? I stand by my original statement, that you must have something seriously wrong with your setup. How else could you completely lose punch from one of the strongest torque motors on the market?

tweaking and tuning seems to have little effect....

I seriously doubt this. Give me any motor, ANY motor, and I can tweak it to make it better.

Ya know, you could tone down your statements. It's one thing to state it is your personal opinion, and that you have had problems with the MVP, but when you make such outrageous comments it makes one wonder if there isn't more to the story.

So what's the scoop? Is that your honest opinion, or are you just trying to stir things up?

[ 07-17-2001: Message edited by: Leet TC3 ]

[mike]

he said it was his personal opinion, twice.
at least he kept his atitude in check.

[Leet TC3]

Sorry dude, prefacing an outrageous, unsupported statement with a "It's my personal opinion" does not excuse someone from the ramifications of making the statement.

And unless you have anything meaningful to add to this thread about the pluses and minuses of the MVP, I suggest it is you who needs attitude adjustment.

[b3buggydude05]

guys guys calm down ,!!!!
im SURE that the mvp cannot be as bad as howie said but im SURE that it has some problems and im SURE that it has lots of ups in it. i have taken both of your opinions and decided that i am going to get the mvp beacause i have only heard good things about it except for howie.But howie it must be somewhat good if you keep racing it, not trying to start anything though.thanx for your opinions both howie and leet,
do i need to hose you two off??!!

[IR]

As an FYI, I have had three MVP's not pro's just regular ol MVP's. I cannot race these. They run way too hot for my taste. We have also had numerous racers on the on road and off road circuits that have melted down their MVP's. This is not an isolated case, it is widespread throughout our area. I can safely say that there is no one that I know of in the southern Idaho area that races with an MVP. It is my opinion that they are indeed the absolute worst stock motor I have ever seen.

[Leet TC3]

Ok, respecting everyone's opinion here. :)

Widespread melting? I have not heard of one case. Not one. Not doubting your word, but you are the first one to mention this happening. There has never been any mention of it on any board or in the media.

Worst stock motor? Then please explain how the guys who are WINNING the national meets, both on road and off road, are able to do this using the worst stock motor ever? Not just winning, but winning with regularity and sweeping the top spots.

And why does everyone make such a big deal over the temperature of the motor? Aside from (presumably) melting something, it has never affected performance one bit for me, or anyone else I know of. In fact, it HAS to run hot. It's a natural byproduct of running fast. I have seen some good mod motors do the same. So what? It's like you put your finger to the motor after a run, feel that it is hot and then immediately say "it ***** " and give up on it.

Check your gearing, check your venting, check your mesh etc. It would be a shame for you to simply give up on one of the best stock motors to come along in the past 5 years.

[XXXER]

We have apparently lost the purpose of this thread.