Should the 2001 Worlds be post-poned?

[jeepinator]

Yep, all these postponements and cancellations I see just upset me a little.
Ya, I know it seems disrespectful to be having fun or whatnot, but it really is not.
If you asked all 5000 dead people what we should be doing, I think they would not be saying, "cancel everything and be effected immensly by the terrorism".
Nope, the consensus would be to continue on, and NOT show them they have succeeded.
It is OK to be emotional about it. It is OK to mourn. It is even OK to want revenge. But to allow your life to impacted is the same as waving a white flag, "I GIVE UP".

[hpiguy]

I agree.
We need to show them that we cannot be beaten this easily.

We need to have a move of solidarity among citizens.

[Cosmo]

I think it should go on. I hear people saying "I realize that sports are not important right now" and "Sports don't matter right now". Well, to a lot of people they do. I respect the NFL and MLB decision not to play. A lot of players were against it. But, for some of us, gathering with friends and family (or even complete strangers) to watch sports and celebrate is good medecine for us right now. The IFMAR championships is the same kind of thing. It gives us something to look forward to. Granted, I can't go to it and will only be able to read about it, but at least I can look forward to that.

[DerekB]

I think some of you are missing the fact that when something does happen it could be big trouble for Americans. Picture yourself trapped in South Africa and unable to return.

[ReMeDy]

Can't you just ride greyhound to wherever your going, if your not so secure with flying right now?

I don't see the benefit in postponing it though.

[jeepinator]

Ride Greyhound to South Africa ?
LOL!

Hehehe, it's called GEOGRAPHY my son.

[jeepinator]

Why would they get stuck over there ?
Let's put it this way ... if I were a racer, sponsor, media, or whatever, I would vote to go. Really. I would get on that plane, fully prepared for weirdness, but I would get on.

[HauntedMyst]

I agree. It should go on and I think you should go. If you don't want to go, send Chris, maybe the South Africans can figure out his hair. I think the letting this effect our everyday lives more then it needs to is letting the terrorists win just a little bit more. In light of the events, i think this just highlights the stupidity of having these races in South Africa. Will there be any S.A.'s even in the race? I have a family, but I would go.

BTW, I don't think this mess is anywhere near being over, it think its just starting. We just have to deal with it.

[DerekB]

Okay here's the scenario. In a little over 3 weeks most of the US drivers and myself leave or would leave for S. Africa. In reality nothing can really happen, but when (which could be soon) the US decides that we need to change the geography of the Middle East, a small war will begin. Now there is a chance that nothing will happen, but consider that it gets bad. World wide terrorism, a Jehad(sp?), begins. Do you think that the US will keep it borders open? Do you think they would be like, we need those 25 Americans back? There is a great possiblity that we are stuck in SOUTH AFRICA, about 2500 miles from where most of you are sitting. You can't walk, swim or catch a bus back...STUCK. For those of you with a family consider not being able to return to protect them. Now there are places I would love to be stuck, (Ireland, Hawaii, playboy mansion) but SA is NOT one of them. Even before this disaster, South Africa had its problem (ecomonic, social). Now let's pretend a war (very likely) happens. Americans in ANY other country are in danger, that's a sad fact.

That's why I would postpone the race. Heck the Rider Cup was put off a full year.

It's very easy to say "I would go" especially when your in the safety of our shores. The reality would be if you actually had to get on a plane an go.

[jeepinator]

I can take good pictures and I do a fair job with writing stuff. If you bail out, I will be happy to take your place.
Serious.
I am not trying to be macho or "out man" you. I would LOVE to go.
I would go. Simple as that.
I have known two people from South Africa. It is NOT zimbabwe or whatever, it is not a 3rd world country. But there are lots of monkeys everywhere ;)
Going to the worlds would be pretty dang cool. I totally see your point, I just think the risk is low.

So, can I go ? Can I Can I ? :p

[TSR6]

I agree with both Jeep & Derek to a certain extent. I truthfully, would go... But i can also see Derek's concern.

[FilthyPierre]

Hmmm, difficult decision. I'd probably be worried if I got stuck in South Africa too, especially if I was an American during a war in which the USA was the main protagonist.
However, you could always bail to Australia, Aussies lurv 'Mericans, and it would be a much safer place than South Africa, I'd wager. Australia has invoked the ANZUS treaty, so you'd be more than welcome, and as far as I know you don't need a visa...Not that that's much consolation.....
But hey, while you're stuck here, you could do a tour of some of the local clubs and write it up for RCCA when there's nothing better to put in there! I can just see it now "Derek's World Tour of Australia".... heh heh.
Good luck whatever you decide.....

[HauntedMyst]

I hear ya. I said I would go and I will go. Email me with RCCA company AmEx card and tell me where to be. :) Email me at this name at that y-a-h-o-o.com place :D

[bluesy]

DerekB... I can completely understand your position. Postpone it. After all it really only another RC car race. Before everyone starts their jets for a flame war think a bit. Yes, this hobby is paramount in our minds. Many of us live and breathe RC cars. But to put someone in a position to be stranded and away from family and friends is not worth it. The world will keep spinning if the race isn't held.

My own recent experience in Manhattan is certainly colouring my opinion. Being 3000 miles from loved ones, unable to use even the most basic transportation, taxis, buses, subways; unable to leave the island of Manhattan was, for me, a lousy experience. And I was still in North America.

I sure the heck wouldn't be flying anywhere overseas for the forseeable future. If that means I've given in and am to be labelled 'chicken'. So be it.

:cool: :cool:

BTW... I still believe the scourge of terrorism should be wiped from the earth forever. Whatever means.......however.....just "Make it so"

[ 09-18-2001: Message edited by: bluesy ]

[Grizzbob]

Well, I said it on Trinity's BB & I'll say it here...yes I really would go(if I had the opportunity). I do understand that there are risks involved, but honestly that threat has existed for longer than many of us realize. I do think that S. Africa is a bit of a bad choice for any international event, (at least, for awhile longer), but I think I'd still feel safer there than I do here. Almost ALL civilized countries outside the U.S. have taken security MUCH more seriously than we have, because they've already dealt with some attacks, we've just been ignoring it becuase it hadn't happened here(until last week). Now, our eyes have been opened, & we're seeing the world more the way it is, but I still wouldn't let that interfere with my life. We all gotta go sometime, & when that time comes, it doesn't matter where you are. However, I do think it would be prudent to try calling the State Dept. about the security in the country you want to go to, but as long as we haven't officially declared war, I'd go(& while Bush has said, "we're at war", it hasn't been declared, that takes approval by the senate, & right now, there's no country to declare war with, unless Afganistan refuses to cooperate, then it may be a possibility). There's still a bit of time to wait & see what happens, so for now, I'd plan to go & be ready to cancel if neccessary(better that than do nothing now & then try to go at the last minute).... :cool:

[andy51289]

The Associated website says that the Team AE isn't going to go.

[ 09-18-2001: Message edited by: andy51289 ]

[HauntedMyst]

If Losi drops out, I'm definately going. It will be just me and a few tribesmen who came out of the bush country and took up r/c. Even though I'm sure they have better reflexes, I'm relatively sure my vague understanding of technology will help me beat them! HauntedMyst IFMAR 2001 Champion!

[andy51289]

If Losi goes, and some qualified AE drivers wanted to go to thw worlds, they probably switch to driving for Losi.

[old phart]

With the magnitude and severity of the terrorist attack we just suffered, cancelling a few weeks worth of ball games and other sporting events is not giving in to the terrorists. This is not a simple deal, folks. We just had the face of a nation changed. The psyche of a nation. Our financial center is in ruins. Thousands of our people, our sisters our brothers, our wives, our husbands were murdered in a most vicious and barbaric way.

This takes a little time to let it all soak in and fully realize what has happened. I know to many it may be just images on a TV screen, but it is so much more than that.

I think it is appropriate that we mourn for more than just a week. I think it is appropriate that we sacrifice a few of our pastimes for the sake of those lost, for just a few more weeks. I agree that we need to get back to normal daily life, but to me that means hard work and keepiong the economy going buy producing goods and buying them and keeping the machine called America working. Baseball games, MTV, and playing with toy cars is very insignificant right now in the scope of world events.

Derek, is absolutely right in being prudent. The poop is about to hit the fan, any time now in the next several weeks it could start. And being in SA would be a truly crappy location to be stuck, let alone dozens of foreign nations.

Family is more important than anything else. Let alone toy cars or the mfg's who want them marketed and pay the bucks. Leaving them to travel at a time we are going to war is not only imprudent, it is foolish and selfish.

My $.02

[DerekB]

Here's another point of view I have been telling people:

With the recent number of shark attacks in Florida consider this. 100 people have been attacked by sharks in the last week (hypothetical, of course) and even with this spike in shark attacks you odds of being attacked are 1 in a million (probably much greater) do you go swimming when an attack happened 20 minutes ago???

Helll no! Do you see the connection with flying and the reality of war. Just like the odds that something could happen if you fly, you wouldn't extend the risk of it happening by forcing the odds. A 100 year storm can happen several times in 100 years. Getting back to normal isn't saying just pretend nothing happened, it did and stuff will be happening. The thought that we could go to war tomorrow or as the plane lands in South Africa is hard to say.

By postponing the event by a reasonable amount of time (say 6 months)it's easier to make a decision whether it is safe to travel. Bravery and stupidity are often confused.

[very low budget racer]

Can I ask why they are being held in S.A.? of all places in the world, why there? not saying it shouldnt be there, but is R/C huge over there or something?

[draggerman11]

Derek, although has nothing to do with the topic, just your example, shark attacks are actually down. Did you know that the save the shark people were FEEDING them right off the coast.

Now, should you travel with the threat of war? No, you might not be able to get back into the country for a long time. Simple as that.

[DerekB]

Here's the first withdrawl from the competition

A quote from Team Associated

" In light of the recent tragic events here in the USA, and with the current instability and uncertainty as to future terrorist actions, we at Team Associated have notified IFMAR that we regretfully withdraw our drivers from the 2001 IFMAR Off Road World Championships.
We do not like to bend to the weight of terrorist actions, but we will not compromise the safety and well-being of our Team.
We sincerely hope that other manufacturers will follow our lead due to these safety concerns and out of respect for the many who have suffered in the tragedy of the past week.
"

Dragger-the recent shark attacks in Florida I think would put that stat a little higher than normal. Your not getting the analogy.

[jeepinator]

Driving on our public roads is the most dangerous thing, statistically, that the average person does.
Your odds of dying on the road are like 100,000 to 1 greater on the road than in a plane. You odds of being mamed are like 1,000,000 to 1 over flying in a plane.
If you stop driving today, never to return to the road ever again, your point has meaning, else you are just placing disproportionate concern on this one event.
I do understand the concern of having a difficult time getting back. That would really suck ... a lot.

One other thought ... why do we even fear dying ? Is it that we are afraid of what comes after ? Do we not want to let go of a good thing ? Sheer genetic influence ?
I am not a religious person. I truly feel that the dead know nothing. So, why do I fear dying ? Hmmm... I have thought about this alot in the last week and I simply cannot honestly answer! It is SUCH A WEIRD QUESTION !

[DerekB]

In light of the recent events and possible future actions about to unfold in the world-Should IFMAR post-pone the event until things settle down?

Personally, I was supposed to attend the race. I am not scared of flying, but the thought that something happens while abroad and not being able to return home to my family is very unsettling.

What are some comments............

[TSR6]

I beleive everything is overwith for now. If i had the chance I would definately go, but i guess i don't have much say if it should be post-poned or not.

Edit - I also beleive it is time to move on. We need to show that we won't be disrupted by terrorism. I think it is best to remember... and move on, yet still keep them in our thoughts & prayers.
-Troy

[ 09-18-2001: Message edited by: TSR6 ]

[Rick Hohwart]

There are some major problems with not having the race. First is that a club is putting on the race and I imagine they would lose a substantial amount of money by canceling it. The people dropping out did not want to go to the race anyway so I don't think that postponing the race for three months will really do anything. They will still not go. Besides Bush says this will "war" will take a long time so do we cancel all events for the next 5 years?

At this time all Peak and Team Orion U.S. drivers are planning on atending (7 drivers total). If the race is cancelled then we will live with that. But if the race goes on we will try our best to be there.

[draggerman11]

Derek, I understood what you meant. If someone has just got bit by a shark, are you going to go in the same water? I understand Derek.

[DerekB]

At this point and time I regretfully announce that Radio Control Car Action will not be present at the upcoming Off-road Worlds. Due to the present uncertainty of World events we feel it is unsafe for travel aboard.


Rick, until something happens it is not safe for World travel. In 6 months it could be different or 2 weeks, but until the we see what happens in the next few weeks I can't see how you would continue to risk the safety of your team.

[Rick Hohwart]

The good thing with our team is that nobody is forced to go. So if they do not want to go they don't have to. Nobody has indicated that they do not want to go.

But we must have some indication from the race organizers or IFMAR if the race is still scheduled as planned.

[Rick Hohwart]

Losi is not going either. The next big race is the Winter Champs in Florida in February. So I am sure you will see any new stuff there assuming air travel is considered safe at that time.

[Rick Hohwart]

Losi is not going either. The next big race is the Winter Champs in Florida in February. So I am sure you will see any new stuff there assuming air travel is considered safe at that time.

[Interceptor]

If I were in charge of the companys, i would not want to risk my drivers either. A new product is not worth the risk to your people. I agree on giving it some time.

[InspGadgt]

This is a difficult choice and only the people that are supposed to go can make it. On one hand we need to show that the US does not bend to terrorism. On the other hand the safety of the participants are at stake here. When the US does go to war then Anti-US sentiments will burn that much hotter making our delegates essentially targets. Granted statistically you have a better chance of dying in a car accident then an airplane accident but that statistic takes in account the whole nation flying not just those travelling internationally. And not taking into account hieghtnend hostilities toward those travelling internationally to lesser developed countries durning a military action.

[KilRuf]

I think the Worlds should be postponed and moved to another location. S.A. can have it the following year. Somewhere less volatile. Perhaps N./S. America? Or even back in Japan or Aus? Anyways, I don't think we or anyone should go. There will be things happening over there very very soon. And we don't need or want anyone getting trapped, hurt, or involved. I think it's best to wait for things to calm down and become more "predictable". And to see just what kind of "war" this will be. My 2¢

Mike

[derekjr_1]

Ok so here is my question. We now know AE team is NOT going. Plain and simple. Losi could drop out but who knows as of yet? So...

If there is no Worlds in SA then how are the companies going to show off the new products? AE is long overdue for a new buggy and they probably wont even come out with another one. What about tires, esc, everything? If there is not going to be a good worlds this year (ONLY LOSi, maybe?? Com on now!) then maybe the big guys such as Losi and AE should have there own Championship here in the U.S. Maybe not a Ifmar or a worlds, but some kind of race to promote and show off the new products. What do you guys think. I personnally want to see some new products that were not at the Chicgo show. The ifmar is a time when the cool products or prototypes come out! :)

[loki]

First of all, I think it's actually a great thing that the Worlds is being held in South Africa. It's an international event, and it needs international venues. As an RC racer, I can't imagine many cooler things than saying "I went to South Africa to race RC's". It would at the very least be a memorable trip.

All that said, I think it's difficult for any Americans to consider *any* form of additional risk right now. So many of us have simply spent too much time considering the preciousness of life in the past week. It's not necessarily a rational thing, especially if you consider it an overreaction. But for all the statistics you can pull out about highway accidents vs. airline accidents/shark attacks/being hit by lighting, you can't get over the fact that these are scary and uncertain times for us. Have a bit of patience, and allow for a bit of irrational behavior.

I personally applaud Associated's, Losi's and RCCA's actions regarding the Worlds. As for whether the Worlds should be postponed, that's far beyond my capability to consider right now.

Loki

[jeepinator]

I think I need some midol

[ 09-20-2001: Message edited by: jeepinator ]