Soldering all wires?

[AnimeKing]

I've seen that a lot of racers solder all of their wires instead of having the bullet plugs and tamiya connectors.

I was wondering A) What is this process called, hard wiring? B) What exactly is done? You solder the ESC and the motor, but do you also solder the battery to the ESC too? Does that mean you have to solder and desolder the battery every time?

I was also looking to find an ESC that would let me do this. I currently only have a pair of Futaba MC330CR that has the bullet and tamiya connectors on it. Do people just use those wires or should you really buy an ESC with solder tabs?

Thanks
(just another one of my getting ready to race posts)

[TimisTim]

a= yes hard wiring
b= yes you have to resolder everytime, and people just place tabs on their batteries and use the wires from the esc to solder to the batt.

I dont know why anyone would want to do this unless they were a VERY harcore racer and looking to get that extra little current through. Todays connectors like Deans Ultra and Sermos Powerpoles are what is called "zero loss connectors" meaning the loss at the connector is so minimal that almost no one would care or notice.

[TBone77]

I've seen that a lot of racers solder all of their wires instead of having the bullet plugs and tamiya connectors.

I was wondering A) What is this process called, hard wiring? B) What exactly is done? You solder the ESC and the motor, but do you also solder the battery to the ESC too? Does that mean you have to solder and desolder the battery every time?

I was also looking to find an ESC that would let me do this. I currently only have a pair of Futaba MC330CR that has the bullet and tamiya connectors on it. Do people just use those wires or should you really buy an ESC with solder tabs?

Thanks
(just another one of my getting ready to race posts)

This is called hard wiring, among other things. Anything you do is going to be better than Tamiya connectors and bullet connectors. There is a class of connectors out there that are loosely referred to as "loss-less connectors". This means that the resistance of the connectors themselves is lower than the wire they are replacing. With a reasonable soldering job (more solder = more resistance), you can have connectors and be operating at 99.99999...% efficiency.

Hard-wiring, unless you're a masochist and have a deep profound love for soldering, is for the pros. Unless you're racing at regional events, it's not worth the effort. Frankly, given the science behind it all, I don't think it's worth the effort PERIOD... but some would disagree with me.

From a connector standpoint, you have several options. The most popular option is Deans (http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXKX39&P=ML) connectors. People like these because they have the absolute lowest resistance of all the connectors out there, beacuse they're very small, and because they're a very tight fit. The downside to them is they are difficult to solder if you're not proficient at soldering, you have only 2 connections per plug (more on that in a moment), and they're a really tight fit. I've listed the tight fit point twice. For some it's a bonus, for others it's a negative. Personally, I don't care for Deans. I'm not good enough at soldering to build them without destroying the plug, and I don't like how tight the fit is (usually the result of my hack soldering job).

The second option is PowerPole (http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXD176&P=ML) connectors. These are also known as Sermos connectors. These are what I use. They're far easier to solder than Deans, but they're bulkier, too. The up-side to them is that you aren't limited to just two connections per plug. For instance, you might want to build a connector from your brushless ESC that has 3 connectors. You can do that with sermos connectors. Another nice thing about them is you can get them very cheaply from places like McMaster-Carr.

Deans connectors are expensive and only available from hobby outlets. Sermos are expensive from hobby outlets, but you can buy them at bulk prices elsewhere. I'm stocked for life and it cost me $30. You can get red, blue, yellow, and white. Deans are red and black only.

Whatever you do, you definitely want to get away from Tamiya connectors. The connections between them are terrible and there is a lot of resistance in them. The heat radiating from them when you're done running is all lost power. A more efficient connection won't waste your batteries by heating the inside of your car via the connection.

[AnimeKing]

Very thorough and information packed posts guys. Thank you very much!

It would probably still be a good idea to solder the motor to the ESC right? Do I need an ESC with solder tabs or should I just cut off the stock connectors if they are tamiya/bullets?

Do you crimp AND solder the PowerPole connectors?

Let's say I put connectors on the battery and the motor. Would I then need 8 PowerPole connectors (4 separate wires and 2 connectors per wire)?

Thanks (again).

[cheerwhiner]

I hardwire my motors because i don't change them after every single run. I only hard wire my batts on my race car because new batts that I get don't come with connectors, so i'd have to wire connectors to them anyway.............. you get the picutre.

but my emaxx has deans plugs, as does my buggy. but even these two have hard wired motors on them.

the professional level escs like the gt7, lrp quantum 2, etc, don't have plugs included so that racers can hard solder them. I have had a novak racer where you were supposed to do this, but i put deans plugs on it. no problems.

[TBone77]

Very thorough and information packed posts guys. Thank you very much!

Not a problem... I was in your shoes about 9 months ago ;) .

It would probably still be a good idea to solder the motor to the ESC right?

If you have no plans of changing your motor or ESC out of your car, then hardwiring isn't a bad idea. I always use connectors just in case... but that's only because I hate to solder and I only want to have to do it once per connection. The only exception is if I'm real tight on space and need to make things as neat as absolutely possible.

Do I need an ESC with solder tabs or should I just cut off the stock connectors if they are tamiya/bullets?

If you're going to be replacing connectors, I'd buy an ESC that has solder tabs. That way if you ruin the wire, you can just replace it.

Do you crimp AND solder the PowerPole connectors?

For some applications, crimping is okay. But for R/C, you're going to get the best connection with the most durability if you solder it. I suppose you could crimp it first and then solder it, but I think that would be a real b*tch to do ;) .
Let's say I put connectors on the battery and the motor. Would I then need 8 PowerPole connectors (4 separate wires and 2 connectors per wire)?

For most connections, you'll need four plugs. Usually when you buy a "set", you'll get enough equipment for one 2-plug connection (2 blacks and 2 reds with 4 poles).

If you go the Sermos/PowerPole route, just make sure you don't buy retail... you can get them so much cheaper from a place like McMaster-Carr.

[nick51]

I direct solder the esc wires to the batteries on my xray b/c i only race it at tracks and never run it in my front street or anything. Also b/c i have a good iron that heats up fast where ever i need it. You prolly woundnt be able to tell a difference from deans to direct soldering, its just wut you like.

[Danno]

The trick to soldering Deans is a pair of pliers with a hair tie (yes I said hair tie , I`m a biker , you`d be suprised how useful they are ) around the handle for a light squeeze to hold the connector , and a hot iron , at very least get the radio shack 35 watt . I`ll post a pic as soon as I get batteries in the camera .

[Legend_Car]

good tip danno i do the same thing but i use rubberbands because they are cheap and i have an abundance of them

[chilledoutuk]

I prefer 4mm gold plugs and i believe there the next best thing to direct soldering.

I used powerpole conectors before I think there naff compared to gold plugs and deans.

For people that cant trust themselfs to not get the polarity wrong all you have to do is make one of the leads too short to reach the conector tubes when there attached to the battery and then make a fly lead for the associated pole so that it can connect.
The result is that if you conect the long lead into the fly lead when you try to conect the short lead it wont reach.

[JB_The_Evader]

I personally think that hardwiring is easier than plugs for some reason (assuming you only run the car at a track). Don't ask me why lol. After having several cars with nothing but hardwired connections, you get used to it.

[AE_racer38]

a better tool to hold the connector while you solder is a locking forceps. you can get them at medical supply stores or from fishing tackle stores. they hold tight and work great,even acting like a "third hand" sometimes.

having raced for years i can tell you there is a difference in power if you use plugs,even with deans plugs. they advertise as having less resistance than the same length of wire. while this is true of the connector itself,you now have two extra solder joints on each wire that you would not otherwise have, and it is noticeable on the track.

my advice is similar to the others. if you race,hardwire. if you don't,use good plugs. the performance difference is more noticeable with stock racing,but it is there regardless.

[LasagnaCat]

One thing that hasn't been mentioned... some people hardwire because it's cheaper than buying plugs if you have a lot of motors/batteries. We personally hardwire the motor and use plugs on the batteries, it's just simpler to charge and handle them with plugs - I can't stand alligator clips, plugs have spoiled me. I've hardwired in the past, there's really not all that much of a difference (running offroad, imho) as far as performance... maybe running 1/12 or oval could be different. You'll see people mention the possibility of plugs coming loose during a run, but I've seen far more people have (bad) solder joints come loose on a hardwired pack than I've seen have Dean's/Race Prep/Sermos plugs come loose. How some people solder is just *scary*. :)

Oh, and as far as the alleged on-track performance gains of hardwiring... hit one tube & have to be marshalled and that's wiped out. The benefits of driving a smooth line and not hitting anything will GREATLY surpass any difference that your wiring will make. When you can *consistently* run near perfect full packs on the track, that's when you should start looking into minor things like wiring options. As long as you're not running Tamiya plugs, you should be good to go.

[TBone77]

^ excellent post.

[desfjr1300]

How some people solder is just *scary*.

And that's really the main thing, right there. How are your soldering skills? If they're anything like mine, you will definately want to stick to plugs. :rolleyes:

[AE_racer38]

sorry,should have included that in my post. i assumed that everyone has been racing for years like me. and we know what happens when you assume......
i should have said that if your skills are such that you can exploit the extra power,then you could hardwire. there is no "alleged" to it. there is a difference,but if you can't drive in mod class yet then you could use connectors for convenience. look at any pro's car. you will not ever see a connector. there is a reason for that. they can use that extra oomph!

[LasagnaCat]

This is *such* a small factor in the grand scheme of things. If it were THAT big of an issue, I'd be getting beaten by people that hardwire on a regular basis. While we run at a highly competitive track, not once have I *ever* had someone say "Oh boy, good thing I hardwired because I had more punch on lap 15 and blew your doors off." It's always "Geez, if you wouldn't have flipped.." or "If Greg hadn't hacked me..." or "I geared the car wrong for the main" or whatnot. I've never once heard someone use hardwiring as a major factor in winning (or losing) a race, except for the odd "I'm in a hurry/my heat is starting" solder joint that goes bad. For all too many people here, threads like this mislead people into thinking that it's a MAJOR gain.. it's not. You can't use "any pro's car" as an example, because often the cars that the pro's drive are very close to box stock. Your average club racer often has more "hop-ups" on their car than any three pro's do. Does your average pro driver NEED a camber mod, or most aluminum parts, or special ceramic uber cool diff balls or $100 bearing sets that a lot of club level racers consider necessary...? Nope. Get a decent setup, the right tires, and the rest is in the driving.

As far as using experience as a reasoning factor.. I've been doing this since the mid 80's. About a month and a half ago I had to borrow an esc at the track because I had one that was glitching that night.. my lap times weren't ANY different from what I normally run. My esc's.. have plugs. The borrowed (same model esc) one.. hardwired. Now I do run offroad, your milage with this running other classes may vary.. but in the offroad world hardwiring is NOT the be-all end-all. If you want that 'extra oomph' while running mod you can always change your motor wind and/or gearing, or simply buy better batteries... both of which affect the real world performance of the car much more than hardwiring will.

Edit: On a side note.. everything I own has plugs mainly because my wife goes with me. If EVERY application (charger, power supply leads, etc.) has a unique brand/set of plugs on it... I don't need to worry as much about her plugging something in wrong and ruining $$$ equipment. If people are going to the track with kids, or are new.. that can be a lifesaver, no need to worry about soldering a pack in backwards or whatnot. If you're worrying about whether or not hardwiring makes THAT much of a difference.. just try it. It only takes a minute or two to try, if it doesn't make much of a difference just go back to plugs and no harm done. Imho unless your driving is *PERFECT*, practice time on the track is still a MUCH more valuable and rewarding tuning aid than wiring this way or that for MOST people here, and especially for the people often asking questions like this that tend to be newer people in the hobby.

[sandboy75]

I cant aggree more with LasagnaCat, I use deans plugs. Not because I can't solder, but because I would not get any extra speed from hard wireing. I just started driving on-road cars and even if hardwireing took 10 seconds off my time or added a extra half lap I would still not be in the front of the pack.

Don't think that makeing your car better is going to make you a better driver. Only driveing will make you better and when .05 seconds or less really counts then you can worry about gaining that little bit extra...

[AE_racer38]

funny how people read more into a post than what's actually there. as a racer,i made my comments from a racer's point of view. then,i actually came back and said that "if you can exploit it" then hardwiring is the way to go. i never said anything about camber mods,or aluminum goodies,or ceramic uber cool diff balls,so i can use any pro's car. i,personally,have never seen a pro run connectors. and yes i have been around pros.i too have been racing since the 80's,and i've been to more than a few races in my day.
i agree that most people would rather use connectors,and good ones are infinitely better than tamiya plugs,but there are some of us that like hardwiring.there's nothing wrong with it. and i do agree with you that practice is the best hop-up. i never said that hardwiring is the be-all end-all,but it has it's place. like i said before,if there was no benefit,no one would do it.please don't take what i said,and change it into something that it wasn't meant to be. nothing in my posts was meant or intended to mislead anyone,so i would appreciate it if you would not put that connotation towards me.

[AnimeKing]

AE_racer38, and all.

Thanks for your posts. I've read them all and was never confused on where each of you was coming from. I value all your opinions and experience. I have come to the conclusion that (for myself) to begin racing I'm going to solder my motor and use deans plugs on my batteries. I am convinced there would be a difference but it's a big step for me to go from tamiya and bullet connectors to hardwiring. If I go anywhere with racing, I'm sure I'll start to hardwire.

Thanks again to everyone.

[AE_racer38]

the main thing is that the decision is yours. good luck!