6 turn motor out of the question

[blueb8llz]

i just want to get several opinions from all of you rc racers out there. i have a big race coming up and i was gonna get a 8 turn motor but now im thinkin why not get a 6 turn.
heres the situation. this is going to be a drag race...about 90 feet long. i will be running a hpi pro3 with 7 cells. im pretty much only gonna run this car for short races ..not really to play. can anyone give me their 2 cent s whether or not i should go 6 turn. all comments/opinions/questions are welcome. thanks yall

[dalejrfan8]

If all you are going to use it for is drag racing then i think it would be ok. But what bothers me is you are using 7 cells instead of 6, and that may fry your esc with a low turn motor like that.

[blueb8llz]

hmmm...i have the cyclone esc...do you think that can handle the 7 cells?

[TimisTim]

I think I remember you saying you have the purple labled cyclone correct? Anyways they dont have a limit on the turns they can run and are rated for 7 cells. It may be the very limit though, so be careful and measure the temps alot.

[blueb8llz]

yea the purple label...ok im not gonna really run it too much...maybe just for 2 races then putting it away.

[SteveK]

Mmm, I don't know that lower turns is the way to go: Many drag racers using 'conventional' setups (IE A sane number of cells and normal motors) often go into the teens in turns, for more torque and better launches off the line. And those are for 132 foot racers: For 90 feet, you'll want even more acceleration than regular dragsters.

[doubleback]

If you want to kick there butt's get a Cobalt Drag motor.

[TEM]

Trinity "Drag Works" motor is what you would want to get if it's brushed motor you're looking at. As for using a Pro3 for a drag chassis, it's alright if you're running against other touring cars. Otherwise a pan car would kill you!

[Needler56]

i ran a trinity d3 6 turn single on my yokomo yr4m2 with a cyclone yellow label, and that thing exploded off the line. will kill your batteries quick tho. blue, are you from alameda??

[blueb8llz]

hahah i am from alameda...do i know you? what u mean it exploded...you mean its took off right...not literally exploded the ESC?

[Needler56]

haha whats up man, i recognized your username and your car setup and realized who it was midway while writing my reply. i'd hate to just blurt out names on the boards n everything, but you called me a couple of weeks ago for directions to hobbytown in concord, i'm one of your bro's friends.

but yea by exploded, i meant it launched off the line like a wrx sti. it was fast, but not as fast as my cousin's tamiya tb01 or tl01 (don't remember) with a novak dually esc and 8turn single trinity D4.

i actually had three of my motors cut today at hobbytown here in san jose. i cleaned them and installed new springs and brushes on them. i haven't tested them yet though.

what's this big race you're entering? i'm bout to slap the 6turn back into the yokomo lol

[blueb8llz]

hahah thas funny..i was like 95 % i thought i was you. wassup mang. dang...his 8 turn beat you? hows that...did you take off on him and he just came back in the end or somthing? how long was the race? lets go run our ish sometime...when i get my motor hahaha.

[Needler56]

lol yea my cousin's car is 4wd shaft and mine is 4wd belt. his had sooo much torque you can see is take off on mine and it would do a lil hop (like when you see them mustangs take off), but mine would catch up quick, we'd be neck and neck, then his would eventually just pull away cause it was just that fast. you know the street along the water where the ferry is on bayfarm? we'd drag that whole distance lol

at the time his car, motor, and esc was brand spankin new, out of the box, where mines was at least 4 or 5 years old where i needed a tune up and a rebuild of my motor. are you in an official race? whatever turn you get, 6, 8, 10, it'll be fast, but keep in mind speed is a measure of gearing.

[highroller]

Since you won't be concerned about runtime - the other major concern with modified motors is the traction conditions. It's hard to say what turn/wind would best but you would acheive the same top speed with almost any modified motor in the 6-13 turn range. Adding more turns or using more strands (double or triple) smoothes the on throttle response without causing the tires to loose traction. Another cheap methods that I and other modified racers use is to buy one or two motors in the turn/wind that you think will work and the two or three armatures differently so you can tailor motor power to track conditions. Don't forget to try changing the timing (increase for more acceleration and decrease if acceleration is too broad). Also make minor changes to pinion/spur to alter power curve a bit. 64 ptich would be ideal for this situation, gives wider gearing ranges and smoother (less friction) than 48 pitch. Use a 115 to 118 for quicker spoolup and larger spur for a slower spoolup. Alter the pinion size to obtain the same rollout when trying different spur combinations.

[blueb8llz]

yo needler imma hit you up. hay highroller..do you know how to do all that gearing stuff?the stuff where u gotta do calculations and all that crap. if yes, you think you can do me a big favor and gear my car for the 6 turn for me. i seriously dont know how to do it. heres my car info: i think the ratio is 2.25 but someone told me its 2.1:1
the tires are 2 and a half inch and 1 inch wide. let me know if you need any other info.. can you tell me what spur and pinion is my optimum set up.

[Needler56]

does the pro3 have an optional 2 speed tranny? if all the rs4's share the same gearing/gearing chart, i had the tallest gear combination based off hpi's gearing chart for my rs4 pro and that thing was fast as hell!! it was a 64 pitch 122t spur and the pinion, i don't remember off the top of my head.

[highroller]

Whatever I suggest probably won't be correct, that's the biggest gray area when talking about gearing. Probably the closest you'll get to finding the correct gearing is by asking the locals, even then you need to compensete for some variables modified racing (adjust for changes in turns or winds, timing used), differences in tire size or small changes between the power two motors make (even two of the same brand).
Racers generally quote gearing in ratio form which is just dividing the spur by pinion, a final drive ratio where the spur is divided by pinion the mutliplied by transmission ratio (81 div by 23 = 3.52 multiplied x 2.1 (transmission ratio) = 7.3956 or 7.40 and rollout which gets a little more instense start out by measure the distance of tires across with a set of caliper then multiply by 3.14 (pi) then multipling that by the tranny ratio and dividing by the gear ratio (spur divided by pinion) to obtain a rollout formula. That would go something like this 2.50 x 3.14 (PI) = 7.85 x 2.1 (transmission ratio) = 16.485 or 16.49 divided by 3.52 (spur 81 divided by 23 pinion) = 4.6846 or 4.7 rollout.

Then another misconception is concerning the speed of modified motors regardless of the number of turns or winds most will obtain the same speeds but generally produce different levels of power in the low and high range (a person posted that result earlier where the guy with a high turn caught him even though he was running a lower turn motor). Less wire (lower turn or less winds) tends to allow the motor to spool up, accelerate to it's maximium speed while a motor with more wire takes a little bit longer to reach it's maximum speed which could be 55mph for both motors. Experienced racers will select a motor with a certain number of turns/winds that has the best balance of on power response for track conditions and still be able to make runtime without overpowering the vehicle and track. Back to gearing which again comes into effect whenever switching between higher to lower turns or the number of wind (single, double, triple) or changing the timing to compensate for the slight changes in the motor's power you need to change the pinion. Going from a 8 turn double to a 7 single (using the same timing) you should drop 1 tooth at least, 2 if the motor is using higher timing or motor has a slightly higher rpm range. To make tuning motor power to track conditions the cheapest method is to purchase 1-2 even 3 complete motors in different turns and winds then a couple of armatures different from the complete motors you have, now it the 6 turn you have is too much for track or you have issues with making runtime swap to a armature say a 8 turn single or 8 turn double that would produce a smoother acceleration curve.

[blueb8llz]

thanks for all that info highroller..but im not gonna be racing at no track or anything...im just gonna run outside my house..or just in parking lots so im not gonna be that technical. i just wanted to do a drag race about 100 feet long, and was just trying to see what spur and pinion would be best for the 6 turn for that application.

[Needler56]

have you decided on what motor to get?

[highroller]

sorry thought what you were doing was drag racing or intending to race. In either case look on the HPI or Associated's site for gearing (final drive ratio) for the motor you plan to use. Start with their recommended ratio, then try different spur and pinion combinations to see which increases speed. Have someone time the distance you are traveling until you acheive the lowest elasped time. Your vehicle should have a ballastic start and be a top speed 3/4 of the distance it has traveled if it starts out hesitantly or tends to still be building speed at the end of the distance it isn't geared correctly, decrease the pinion size by 1-2 teeth and repeat. When you achieve a good holeshot and speed that should be the ideal gearing combination. Write it down in case you need to refer to it later.

[blueb8llz]

got it thanks. needler..im prolly gonna get a 6 turn orion v2 motor.