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View Full Version : Gear Ratio Questions for my project truck...............


kojak61
08-31-2001, 03:47 PM
Email me updates on how its going please I am really interested is this project of yours. As for gear ratios, I know if you plan to run off road 32 pitch might strip easy. This was copied from http://www.proracersecrets.com/

The gears of a car follow a simple concept but can have an enormous effect on the performance of the vehicle. The diameter of the gears should be adjusted to match the specific application in which the vehicle will be used for. This means that a different gearing will be used for a large track with sweeping turns than for a small track with tight turns.

A simple explanation of gearing is necessary. Basically, a large pinion gear (the little gear attached to the motor) will offer increased top speed and decreased acceleration and a smaller pinion gear will offer decreased top speed and increased acceleration. The opposite is true for spur gears (the large gear attached to the tranny that the pinion gears runs against), a smaller spur gear will increase top speed and decrease acceleration while a larger spur gear will decrease top speed and increase acceleration. A standard way of comparing gear sizes between cars is to use Gear Ratios.

There are 2 basic types of gear ratios for your RC car, the pinion to spur ratio and the overall drive train ratio. To equate the pinion to spur ratio, a simple formula is used:

Pinion to Spur gear ratio = # of teeth on spur gear / # of teeth on pinion gear

To give an example, assume you have a 25 tooth pinion gear and a 100 tooth spur gear installed on your car. The pinion to spur ratio is 100/25 = 4. Therefore; your pinion to spur gear ratio is 4 to1. This means that the motor must rotate 4 times to rotate the spur gear once.

The other basic gear ratio is the overall drive train ratio. To equate this, the following formula is used:

Overall Drive Train Ratio = (# teeth on spur gear / # teeth on pinion gear) x Tranny Gear Ratio

Here is an example. Assume you have a 25 tooth pinion gear and a 100 tooth spur gear installed on your car. Your transmission gear ratio is 2.25 to 1 (the transmission gear ratio is complicated to equate but it is usually given to you in the transmission instructions). The overall drive train ratio is (100 / 25) x 2.25 = 9. Therefore; your overall drive train ratio is 9 to 1. This means that the motor must turn 9 times to fully rotate the wheels of the car once.

Sometimes people refer to the gear ratio of the car instead of the number of teeth on the pinion and spur gears. A low gear ratio number will offer increased speed and decreased acceleration and a high gear ratio number will offer decreased top speed and increased acceleration. For example, a 3 to 1 ratio will give your car more speed and less acceleration than a 5 to 1 ratio.

It is important to understand that there are limitations to what an electric motor can handle when it comes to gearing your car. This means that a larger pinion and a smaller spur will increase your vehicles top speed up to the point in which the motor is overloaded. When the gear ratio is too low, the motor will not have enough output to benefit, and reduced performance can be expected. The key here is that a proper gear ratio is very important. Don't just put on the largest pinion gear and smallest spur gear that you can find and expect to go fast.

Another issue regarding gear ratios is tire size. The size of the cars tire will have an effect on the speed a vehicle reaches. A larger tire is like running a lower gear ratio and a smaller tire is like running a higher gear ratio. The formula used to calculate gear ratios that take tire size into consideration are very complex and aren't necessary for most applications. Just remember that a larger tire will increase top speed and decrease acceleration and a smaller tire will decrease top speed but increase acceleration.

There is no strict rule for setting up gear ratios in your vehicle. Different cars, tracks, motors, batteries, driving style and many more variables all affect the size of the gears to be used. The best method of setting up your own ratios is to start with manufacturer recommendations and then experiment on your own. Use a stop watch to see if changes you make are for the better. The proper gear ratio selection can make the difference between an A main finish and no finish at all.

Jonathan210
08-31-2001, 04:03 PM
Well i need to know a final gear ratio first. Like for the RS4 electric MT. What is the final gear ratio? once i get that i will shoot for that and see how i can acheive that.

Jonathan210
08-31-2001, 06:33 PM
Here are my cad designs so far http://**************** /cad/ If you have any suggestions or comments please tell me. All of the cad files there are the same but in differnt format. If you dont have cad there is a free download here http://www.digitalriver.com/dr/v2/ec_MAIN.Entry17c?CID=34654&SP=10007&PN=5&SID=25271&PID=242274 Of TURBO CAD 2d. Thats what i used. If anyone can make this 3d that would be awesome. E-mail me if you have autocad and know how to use it, where you can make this 3d. Thanks

Oh and guys this isnt spam. I mean its just some files. Im not linking to my web site. Just files.

kojak61
08-31-2001, 07:46 PM
For the rs4 mt its 2.6 x(25tooth spur/76 tooth pinion). Basiclly you take the spur and pinion you pick and divide the spur's teeth number by the pinion's tooth number. Then you take that number and mulitply by the trans reduction or gearbox ratio, that gives you the final gear ratio. 2.6 is the gearbox ratio for the RS4 MT.

[ 08-31-2001: Message edited by: kojak61 ]

kojak61
08-31-2001, 07:59 PM
At the end of this page there is the gear ratio chart for the RS4 MT. http://www.geocities.com/geokojak61/gearratio.html

Jonathan210
08-31-2001, 09:20 PM
So the final ratio of the EMT is 2.6?

According to what you said the NMT has a final gear ratio of 12.5
12/52 times the trans ratio of 2.92 or is the 2.92 that i got from rcca actually the final gear ratio? It said trans ratio.

What pinion/spur would i have to get if i want to make the NMT equal to the EMT? EMT is rs4 electric mt and the NMT is the rs4 nitro mt. If you didnt know, i think its the nickname on HPIracing.com

Jonathan210
08-31-2001, 09:24 PM
I guess you where talking about the drive ratio, not the final gear ratio. Becuase on that chart it says 2.6 is the drive ratio. I thought they where the same thing. I though it was transmission ratio. So what is the actual "final gear ratio" of the stock EMT?

From that chart i think i want to gear my project EMT/NMT to around 10.00 ratio. How would i acheive this? As soon as i find the final drive ratio of the NMT i think i can figure the rest out. I need the NMT final gear ratio and the EMT final gear ratio.

kojak61
08-31-2001, 11:06 PM
On gas you would change the spur and clutch bell to adjust gearing and on electric you adjust spur and pinion. Also gas uses 64 pitch and electric uses 48 pitch gear they are not quite the same. You want be able to give them the same trans ratio. You can only adjust the final gear ratio.These will always be the same emt 2.6 and 2.9 for nmt. On the chart it does the math for you. Just line up the spur and pinion and where the 2 lines meet that is the ratio.

kojak61
08-31-2001, 11:08 PM
Read my first reply completly it tells you everything you need to know.

kojak61
08-31-2001, 11:16 PM
Even though its going to be electric since you are using the nmt gearboxes, you must use the nmt gear ratio of 2.92. The emt ratio does not matter. To use the emt ratio you have to use the emt's tranny.
http://www.webphix.com/rcsite/default.asp
gear finder program on this site.
2.92 x (96 tooth spur/28 tooth pinion)= 10.

[ 08-31-2001: Message edited by: kojak61 ]

Jonathan210
09-01-2001, 12:50 AM
I am doing a project truck. It will be dual battery/ dual motor shaft driven stadium truck. I will be using the front a rear end of a nitro rs4 MT. My question is how can I make the RS4’s trans reduction of 2.92:1 exqual to one like the Yokomo MR-4 MT, which has 2.2:1 ? I don’t know the final gear ratio of either one or maybe that is the final gear ratio, I don’t know I found it in your magizine. The RS4 nitro mt has 12/52 tooth clutch bell/ spur. Now what is the final gear ratio there? I want to get the gear ratio correct for my project. I want something kinda fast but not that it has no run time. I want it somewhere inbettween the E-maxx 1st and 2nd gear. I’m planning on using 32pitch gears if that matters. If you have a suggestion on the gear ratio I should shoot for please tell me. I know that this thing will be kinda heavy, but I want it to top a E-maxx. I think it will be much lighter then a E-maxx and hopefully faster. I’m thinking like 3 pounds lighter. But the E-maxx has the 2speed trans so I don’t know if it could spoll up fast and stuff. Please help, I read that gear ratio article but couldn’t understand it.

How come your not excepting new users in your live chat? I tried to join but it says your not excepting new users.

Jonathan210
09-01-2001, 08:38 AM
I'm just trying to get the nmt to the final gear ratio of a EMT. Its something to shoot for. THE NMT has a high gear ratio. I want on like the EMT. SO i want my nmt final gear ratio to equal the stock emt final gear ratio. Understand?

kojak61
09-01-2001, 10:20 AM
21t pinion and 91t spur will give you 12.65.
That the ratio to shoot for. With 48 pitch gears. It still might not run like the nmt because electric motors spin up faster than gas. This ratio might work or it will fry your motor. Good Luck

Railman
09-01-2001, 11:01 AM
Jonathan, Are you using the same size wheels in this conversion? To get the actual final
rollout SPEED, you need to account for the change in the wheels' circumferance. I'm not familiar with the vehicles mentioned. If your not changing the size of the wheels, roll out is simple.
Spur / clutch or pinion x trans reduction = rollout. If you don't know the transmission reduction, count the diff gear teeth & divide by thr topshaft teeth. That's it! Just run the numbers on each scenario till you get what you want. If you need to account for the size of the wheels, you need a bench mark to compare to. That sounds like it would be the E Max between 1st & 2nd gear. Calculate that roll out SPEED 1st. It doesn't really matter what motor rpm you use as long as it's the same in each scenario. Try 20,000 rpm. If you know that the final reduction is 10 to 1, then you would have 10 motor revolutions to 1 whell revolution. If the wheels were 4" diam, then it's circumferance would be 2x2x3.14=12.56" . At 20,000 motor rpm the wheels' rolling speed would be: 20,000/10x12.56=25,120" per minute. If you wanted mph you would need to convert to minutes to hrs & inches to ft. That a little more confusing, but I like to do those calculation as a ratio comparison, (which is what your trying to do with the ratios in the 1st place)
25,120/60seconds = ft/360seconds. Same as 25,120 x 360/60 =
150,720 ft per minute. For mph divide that no by 5,280. 150,720/5280=28.55 mph. The thing is I don't know the vehicles your talking about & don't know what motor/engine your running, so I can't tell much more than how to get the numbers you need. I hope this helps. If not ask again with more input info. Joe

;)

Jonathan210
09-01-2001, 04:01 PM
I'm going to use dirt hawgs or mashers.

Kojak61- i think you are confused. Gas uses 32 pitch. 32 pitch is much bigger then 48pitch. They mostly use 64pitch in touring cars. I'm almost positive. Yea i think i am. Anyone else going to back up my answer. SO i want to use either 48pitch or 32pitch. Not 64pitch.

Lotus00
09-02-2001, 04:30 PM
32 pitch gears are the big ones, 64 is the smallest and 48 is in the middle.
Jonathan you are right, you win the million dollar prize!

Jonathan210
09-02-2001, 04:45 PM
I just wanted him to know right.